I'm confused. M&P and Co-x took the standard Hilcorp lease, word for word and changed/added a few addenda. I have copies of both. Hilcorp was more than happy to have you sign direct with them. So why pay the commission? Negotiate a few addenda on your own. I'm not seeing that minimal amount of work worthy of that commission, or any commission for that matter. If they had a lease like the S.U.R.E. lease or Friendsville lease, then definitely. Those leases were about 17 pages versus 3 pages. What was really funny was that they put a lot more time in the contract you signed for them to represent you than they did for the lease they wanted you to sign. That contract was actually longer than the lease! So for 6,7,8% and $250/acre you got a couple of addenda. Can anyone explain this to me?
Reply to Tim R: You refer to the friendship lease and the SURE lease with the implication that they are good leases. Can you refer me to where I might get a copy of each of those leases. If and when I am lucky enough to get a decent offer, it would be helpful to perhaps look at those leases for language that I as a landowner might be able to negotiate into such lease as I might sign. Thanks in advance for any help.
Thanks Tim for posting this. It may be helpful to me and to a number of others following this discussion. Perhaps M&P will also read it; and perhaps not. At least thanks to you there are now two references where landowners can find info to help them look out for themselves.
Tim ty every lease that pops into a land owners view here is a education for a landowner.
Thanks for the info. Tim. After reading the Friendsville Group lease, I'm extremely disappointed in signing with M&P and Co-X group.
You are unlikely to be able to negotiate all the terms in the group leases if yo are negotiating on your own. We had 10,000 acres (in Carroll county) in the Sure Group and I believe the first ALOV group was 70,000 acres (spread across 5 counties?).
I probably could have gotten a larger signing bonus if I hadn't gone with SURE and signed with REX but I don't think I would have gotten the other terms as landowner friendly as I did.
The last page on this discussion has been very helpful. As an unleased landowner I thank you all.
Oh, where did Jim L. go?
Jim L. , I have followed most of your posts and believe you have been very honest and provided a ton of valuable information. However, once other lease details become available for compairison and you are not here......
This information was readily available. The Friendsville lease I believe is 2 1/2 years old. Those people put together one hell of a group, I give them credit. Even though ALOV has been criticized they got a way better lease from BP than this, I give them credit too.
Here is another link for those who want more information. It's a simple lease checklist from the Texas Land and Minerals Association.
Many of my neighbors signed even after trying to educate them. It is a shame Mercer County didn't develop a real landowner group instead of an astro-turf one. This so called group was an out of town company coming in and getting people to sign a legal contract for them to represent you. Their incentive was to get commissions, unlike a true landowner group like the one in Venango county made up of actual landowners. If these guys had a lease like ALOV or Friendsville they would be worth every penny of their commission. If you compare the Hilcorp lease to the Co-x, how much work did they actually do? To me it appears they spent a lot more time marketing their services than they did negotiating a lease. I urge everyone to read both leases and decide what the difference is worth. I'm not faulting them, they are businessmen making a buck, and it is what it is. Given the two similar leases I would pick the one direct with the oil company and skip the commission.
They say this is a "landowner friendly lease". I would be willing to discuss with Jim L., or any one else, any section in the lease and when compared to true landowner group leases it falls short. It doesn't even pass many on the items in the checklist I have linked above.
If there is enough people in Mercer County not leased maybe we should start a group?
Tracy: Could you post whether or not you have received your bonus money? Seems this thread has more or less died out. I am not a defender of M&P but if indeed you have gotten your money, then I would guess that you are now a lot happier. Hope that my assumption is correct. Best wishes.
No, unfortunately, I am still patiently waiting. I plan on waiting until May 1st, and then M&P will get another call from me. It is clearly stated in my lease that if payment is not made after 20 days from the expiration date that I can then look for someone else to lease with. They haven't filed their lease on my property at the courthouse yet either.