How much water is used by fracking..... - GoMarcellusShale.com2024-03-28T18:19:19Zhttps://gomarcellusshale.com/forum/topics/how-much-water-is-used-by-fracking?commentId=2274639%3AComment%3A245265&feed=yes&xn_auth=noRadioactive materials natural…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-03-06:2274639:Comment:2519692012-03-06T23:29:09.627Ztime will tellhttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/harryboyd
<p>Radioactive materials naturally occur under ground Drill , maybe a small amount comes from other sources .</p>
<p>Radioactive materials naturally occur under ground Drill , maybe a small amount comes from other sources .</p> Carol, re: who gets 'our' w…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-03-06:2274639:Comment:2518322012-03-06T18:19:06.177ZPA roughneckhttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/PAroughneck
<p>Carol,<br></br> re: who gets 'our' water when the gas is burned? As you've noted it would depend upon where the gas was burned. Considering that water vapor is a byproduct of the combustion of ANY hydrocarbon, as well as the fact that weather, at least in the US, tends to move west to east, here in PA we are seeing the water produced via the burning of hydrocarbons in the states to our east. Water from the gas burned here will probably actually end up falling as rain over the Atlantic!<br></br> …</p>
<p>Carol,<br/> re: who gets 'our' water when the gas is burned? As you've noted it would depend upon where the gas was burned. Considering that water vapor is a byproduct of the combustion of ANY hydrocarbon, as well as the fact that weather, at least in the US, tends to move west to east, here in PA we are seeing the water produced via the burning of hydrocarbons in the states to our east. Water from the gas burned here will probably actually end up falling as rain over the Atlantic!<br/> As far as exports go, I have my doubts regarding the financial viability of exporting Marcellus gas to China, or anywhere else for that matter. Certainly in the short term, more money can be made selling our gas on the world LNG market than can be realized selling it domestically.<br/> The advent of shale drilling however, has basically turned the tables on energy production. Some countries, like China and India, that lacked conventional reserves have in fact VAST shale resources that may very well be worthwhile for themselves to exploit.<br/> I'm thinking that the co's looking at spending enormous sums of capital on LNG export terminals, will see their investments sitting idle, much as their domestic LNG import terminals do now, thanks solely to the advent of the shales.<br/> See what China is looking at here-<a href="http://http://www.ogj.com/articles/print/vol-110/issue-3/exploration-development/china-vigorously-promoting.html" target="_blank"></a><a href="http://www.ogj.com/articles/print/vol-110/issue-3/exploration-development/china-vigorously-promoting.html" target="_blank">http://www.ogj.com/articles/print/vol-110/issue-3/exploration-development/china-vigorously-promoting.html</a><br/> To get an idea of just what a 'game changer' the 'shale revolution' is, try this essay-<a href="http://www.cst.net/geoscience/oil-business/129-extrapolate-horizontal-hydraulic-fracturing-technology-into-the-future-what-might-we-see" target="_blank">http://www.cst.net/geoscience/oil-business/129-extrapolate-horizontal-hydraulic-fracturing-technology-into-the-future-what-might-we-see</a></p> Carol,
The incentive is calle…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-02-27:2274639:Comment:2472192012-02-27T04:43:46.704ZJim Shooshttps://gomarcellusshale.com/xn/detail/u_1zmcv26fki85q
<p>Carol,</p>
<p>The incentive is called money. When a hauler can shave 400 miles and 8 hours of drive time off of his cost structure by only driving 5 miles to an obscure spot, he profits. We aren't talking about guys who are overly intelligent, they are greedy and stupid. The checks and balances that are in place will eventually reveal their illegal activities. Their fraudulent delivery receipts will discovered when they don't match up with the receipts at the facilities that are licensed…</p>
<p>Carol,</p>
<p>The incentive is called money. When a hauler can shave 400 miles and 8 hours of drive time off of his cost structure by only driving 5 miles to an obscure spot, he profits. We aren't talking about guys who are overly intelligent, they are greedy and stupid. The checks and balances that are in place will eventually reveal their illegal activities. Their fraudulent delivery receipts will discovered when they don't match up with the receipts at the facilities that are licensed to treat and dispose of frac water. These stupid and greedy individuals fortunately don't outnumber the overwhelming majority of contractors that do exactly what they are hired to do. All the legislation and regulation in the world won't stop criminals, the overflowing prison systems have proven that. But don't place legitimate oil and gas operators into the same box with these criminals.</p> I think you're right. This is…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-02-27:2274639:Comment:2469952012-02-27T00:00:08.776ZCarol Kuniholmhttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/CarolKuniholm
<p>I think you're right. This is a huge issue -and if it was addressed seriously I think a lot of the opposition to fracking would quiet down.</p>
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<p>I think you're right. This is a huge issue -and if it was addressed seriously I think a lot of the opposition to fracking would quiet down.</p>
<p></p> I'm impressed by all the math…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-02-26:2274639:Comment:2468852012-02-26T23:57:32.799ZCarol Kuniholmhttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/CarolKuniholm
<p>I'm impressed by all the math. And by the idea - which makes sense- that the water is recaptured when the gas is burned. </p>
<p>But that sets me wondering if it matters where the gas ends up - if it's piped to the coast and shipped to China, do they get our water?</p>
<p>Not sure that matters - there's more on that one that sets me wondering: like how it helps our energy independence if we ship our gas to china, and why it would be considered "public domain" to build the pipelines, if the…</p>
<p>I'm impressed by all the math. And by the idea - which makes sense- that the water is recaptured when the gas is burned. </p>
<p>But that sets me wondering if it matters where the gas ends up - if it's piped to the coast and shipped to China, do they get our water?</p>
<p>Not sure that matters - there's more on that one that sets me wondering: like how it helps our energy independence if we ship our gas to china, and why it would be considered "public domain" to build the pipelines, if the profits go to the gas companies. But those are different questions. So thanks for the info about the water produced. </p> Hi Carol,
You've mentioned pr…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-02-24:2274639:Comment:2460162012-02-24T05:57:04.696ZMudhttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/ChadBenedict
<p>Hi Carol,</p>
<p>You've mentioned previously that you're interested in open and fair discussion of the dangers involved in natural gas drilling in general and hydraulic fracturing in particular. To that end you weighed in here, questioning the consumption of surface water. It's a valid concern and I am happy that the on-site recycling of flowback water is coming online (Rettew has recently designed a system, among others). It will reduce traffic, damage to roads, water treatment facilities,…</p>
<p>Hi Carol,</p>
<p>You've mentioned previously that you're interested in open and fair discussion of the dangers involved in natural gas drilling in general and hydraulic fracturing in particular. To that end you weighed in here, questioning the consumption of surface water. It's a valid concern and I am happy that the on-site recycling of flowback water is coming online (Rettew has recently designed a system, among others). It will reduce traffic, damage to roads, water treatment facilities, and surface water supplies. All good things. And yes, your understanding of the water cycle is correct. :)</p>
<p>So you see this isn't an attack. I appreciate your position but think it would help your credibility if you acknowledged what PA roughneck pointed out that combustion creates a net gain in surface water. You asked a good question and got a good answer. If you're truly interested in honest discussion and expect people to see reason you should do so yourself and acknowledge that. Perhaps it would help some of the more excitable members here to keep calm when someone doesn't agree with them wholeheartedly. Just a suggestion. Have a good day.</p> Agreed area man, that's my po…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-02-22:2274639:Comment:2454722012-02-22T23:55:36.478Ztime will tellhttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/harryboyd
<p>Agreed area man, that's my point . There is a few shallow well developers have done just that , dumping spent frac water to save money ,Thats a fact .</p>
<p>There's a sight called landman report card that exposes lets call them short falls in the industry . </p>
<p>To my knowledge no one in the deep shale has done this kind of thing or would dream of it . </p>
<p>Agreed area man, that's my point . There is a few shallow well developers have done just that , dumping spent frac water to save money ,Thats a fact .</p>
<p>There's a sight called landman report card that exposes lets call them short falls in the industry . </p>
<p>To my knowledge no one in the deep shale has done this kind of thing or would dream of it . </p> Yes, I am well aware of these…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-02-22:2274639:Comment:2454582012-02-22T23:04:07.530ZArea Manhttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/MattDensmore
<p>Yes, I am well aware of these instances. These are the disposal services - its up to a company to choose a reputable service provider, I think everyone would agree, but no one is flowing their wells back into the local creeks, or opening up the water trucks once they leave the pad.</p>
<p>Essentially, you are referring to organized crime and I don't think you can hold an industry accountable for those extreme outliers.</p>
<p>Yes, I am well aware of these instances. These are the disposal services - its up to a company to choose a reputable service provider, I think everyone would agree, but no one is flowing their wells back into the local creeks, or opening up the water trucks once they leave the pad.</p>
<p>Essentially, you are referring to organized crime and I don't think you can hold an industry accountable for those extreme outliers.</p> roughneck, I agree about the…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-02-22:2274639:Comment:2452652012-02-22T22:26:31.723Zcraighttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/craigsmith
<p>roughneck, I agree about the safety of propane, but I'm willing to keep the door open to the idea of using something different if possible. Especially if proves to be a leap forward in oil field practices.</p>
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<p>roughneck, I agree about the safety of propane, but I'm willing to keep the door open to the idea of using something different if possible. Especially if proves to be a leap forward in oil field practices.</p>
<p></p> Jim, my figures may be off, i…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-02-22:2274639:Comment:2451662012-02-22T22:16:49.655ZPA roughneckhttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/PAroughneck
<p>Jim, my figures may be off, it's been some time since HS Chemistry class :)<br></br> <br></br> I arrived at my numbers via the following-<br></br> Combustion of methane-<br></br> CH4 +2 O2--> CO2 + 2 H20<br></br> Thus one mole of CH4 at STP occupies 22.4 liters (ideal gas law), producing 2 moles of H2O.<br></br> 1000 cubic feet =28,316.8 liters/22.4= 1264 moles.<br></br> 1264 moles x 2= 2528 moles of H2O<br></br> 2528 moles of H20 @ 18g/mole=45,504g of H2O<br></br> 45,504g/454 (g/lb)=100.22 lbs H20<br></br> 100 lbs H20/ 8.36…</p>
<p>Jim, my figures may be off, it's been some time since HS Chemistry class :)<br/> <br/> I arrived at my numbers via the following-<br/> Combustion of methane-<br/> CH4 +2 O2--> CO2 + 2 H20<br/> Thus one mole of CH4 at STP occupies 22.4 liters (ideal gas law), producing 2 moles of H2O.<br/> 1000 cubic feet =28,316.8 liters/22.4= 1264 moles.<br/> 1264 moles x 2= 2528 moles of H2O<br/> 2528 moles of H20 @ 18g/mole=45,504g of H2O<br/> 45,504g/454 (g/lb)=100.22 lbs H20<br/> 100 lbs H20/ 8.36 (lb/gal)=11.96 gallons.<br/><br/>If you happen to see any errors in my math or the chemistry itself, feel free to point them out. Like I said, it's been a loooong time since chemistry class!</p>
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