Interesting factoid about Cabot O & G - GoMarcellusShale.com2024-03-28T20:38:58Zhttps://gomarcellusshale.com/forum/topics/interesting-factoid-about-cabot-o-g?commentId=2274639%3AComment%3A259178&feed=yes&xn_auth=noI wasn't trying to minimize t…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-03-24:2274639:Comment:2602302012-03-24T23:05:19.490ZTom Copleyhttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/TomCopley
<p>I wasn't trying to minimize the problem, only place it into a little bit of perspective. Let's start with one assumption--no one ranging from PADEP, to gas drilling companies, or local landowner/landlords want you to ever experience any problems with your drinking water. Natural gas migration is a fact of life in areas that are sitting on top of massive hydrocarbon deposits. Your water is not polluted with methane, even if there are zillions of little methane bubbles in it. Methane is a…</p>
<p>I wasn't trying to minimize the problem, only place it into a little bit of perspective. Let's start with one assumption--no one ranging from PADEP, to gas drilling companies, or local landowner/landlords want you to ever experience any problems with your drinking water. Natural gas migration is a fact of life in areas that are sitting on top of massive hydrocarbon deposits. Your water is not polluted with methane, even if there are zillions of little methane bubbles in it. Methane is a non-toxic, oderless, colorless gas that is lighter than air, and if given a chance through venting, will naturally exit your well water. I'd call it more of a condition, that may cost some bucks to correct, but is fixable. The bubbles will completely disappear out of a glass of water sitting out in the open after only a minute or two.</p>
<p>Most of the issues simply boil down to money, and who is going to pay for making sure homeowners continue to have that nice crystal clear water that everyone wants to have. The Penn State report may have been a little over-dramatic when referring to "173 potential disasters" unless they were suggesting gas explosions or cases of asphyxiation. These are pretty rare, because people take precautions and vent and/or aerate their wells. More likely, these homeowners will be able to light their tap water on fire, which I would call more of an idiot's delight than a potential disaster. Who knows? It might even lead them to a role in the <em>Gasland</em> sequel.</p>
<p>Companies drilling the wells know that there is a great deal of naturally occurring methane in the areas where they are drilling. If a homeowner already has methane before drilling, obviously the company doesn't want to foot the bill for fixing it. However, if methane migration can occur as the result of something as simple as changes in barometric pressure, then any kind of ground disturbance that occurs with drilling, could obviously stimulate migration too. It's more a question of who gets stuck with the bill for restoring the aesthetic quality of the water. Perhaps a qualified attorney could best advise you on that, but obviously having before and after (drilling) water tests available would give any homeowner a very strong hand in collecting damages from the drilling company.</p>
<p>Since, as you mention, regulations are getting more strict, the issue of shoddy well casings that cause methane leaks, is possibly overblown.</p> hey tom... just wanted to pas…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-03-24:2274639:Comment:2603212012-03-24T22:05:39.356Zjihttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/jamesirwin
<p>hey tom... just wanted to pass on something I found interesting if your still following this part of the thread. It's a 2010 PA DEP report regarding o&g well construction rules. It mentioned something I had been wondering about; casing failures per well drilled. I have a water well and will be living VERY close to one these gas wells soon so it was a obvious concern for me. ( …</p>
<p>hey tom... just wanted to pass on something I found interesting if your still following this part of the thread. It's a 2010 PA DEP report regarding o&g well construction rules. It mentioned something I had been wondering about; casing failures per well drilled. I have a water well and will be living VERY close to one these gas wells soon so it was a obvious concern for me. ( <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.personal.psu.edu/ree5047/media/marcellus_proposal.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.personal.psu.edu/ree5047/media/marcellus_proposal.pdf</a> )</p>
<p>The part I found most interesting was the following:</p>
<p>"DEP predicts to issue approximately 5200 Marcellus well permits in 2010 (Wilber). Given the amount of documented methane migration cases in comparison with the total count of active Marcellus wells, the odds of fresh water contamination resulting from poor well construction is approximately 0.03 or 1 out of every 30 wells. This translates to approximately 173 potential disasters when those wells begin construction, a very scary and possible reality."</p>
<p>The regulations have been changed since then so the odds are going to change for the better obviously but it shows want a overwhelming problem that PA DEP originally encountered and the future reality of methane migration and how to deal with it.</p>
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<p></p> Thanks Russia Today for this…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-03-23:2274639:Comment:2596622012-03-23T19:01:48.220ZTom Copleyhttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/TomCopley
<p>Thanks <strong>Russia Today</strong> <a href="http://youtu.be/CCNtW8ydCZY" target="_blank">for this fine example</a> of "Chicken Little" reporting. Not suitable for small children to watch. Too scarey!</p>
<p>Thanks <strong>Russia Today</strong> <a href="http://youtu.be/CCNtW8ydCZY" target="_blank">for this fine example</a> of "Chicken Little" reporting. Not suitable for small children to watch. Too scarey!</p> Ji...
http://online.wsj.com/h…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-03-23:2274639:Comment:2594042012-03-23T16:07:50.132ZJim Shooshttps://gomarcellusshale.com/xn/detail/u_1zmcv26fki85q
<p>Ji...</p>
<p><a href="http://online.wsj.com/home-page?refresh=on">http://online.wsj.com/home-page?refresh=on</a></p>
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<p>Ji...</p>
<p><a href="http://online.wsj.com/home-page?refresh=on">http://online.wsj.com/home-page?refresh=on</a></p>
<p></p> Sounds like Cabot is making…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-03-23:2274639:Comment:2594442012-03-23T02:02:37.946Zjihttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/jamesirwin
<p> Sounds like Cabot is making a positive and an appropriate response to the situation.</p>
<p> Sounds like Cabot is making a positive and an appropriate response to the situation.</p> unbelievable.tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-03-23:2274639:Comment:2595192012-03-23T01:59:38.130Zjihttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/jamesirwin
<p>unbelievable.</p>
<p>unbelievable.</p> I only meant that if it "ain'…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-03-22:2274639:Comment:2594252012-03-22T22:47:17.167ZTom Copleyhttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/TomCopley
<p>I only meant that if it "ain't broke, why fix it". From what I can gather, methane in well water is pretty common both in western PA and the northeastern part of the state. It can have a variety of causes besides oil and gas wells, although leaking wells are certainly a big issue and there are tens of thousands of them, both active and abandoned. Other causes can include coal seams, landfills, pipe lines, or migration from bedrock. Even shifts in the barometric pressure can cause gas to…</p>
<p>I only meant that if it "ain't broke, why fix it". From what I can gather, methane in well water is pretty common both in western PA and the northeastern part of the state. It can have a variety of causes besides oil and gas wells, although leaking wells are certainly a big issue and there are tens of thousands of them, both active and abandoned. Other causes can include coal seams, landfills, pipe lines, or migration from bedrock. Even shifts in the barometric pressure can cause gas to migrate. It's not so easy to detect methane, since it is oderless and colorless, without aid of a gas sniffer.</p>
<p>People who live in these areas are used to dealing with this problem. They vent their wells and use aeration systems when required. Oil and gas well owners are responsible for fixing any gas leaks, or if a well owner can't be located, then PADEP is supposed take care of orphan wells. Gas explosions can occasionally occur, but they are treated like any other household calamity such as a fire or water damage. Homeowner's insurance covers it. The Lenox Township property owners, mentioned in this article, the ones that have elevated methane levels in their water wells, may indeed have a cause for legal action against owners of the natural gas well--assuming they can prove that the cause of methane contamination was the gas well.</p>
<p>Cabot appears to be working with the property owners and bringing them replacement water, so that's a good thing, right?</p> Ji... I'll tell you what's a…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-03-22:2274639:Comment:2594242012-03-22T22:42:50.088ZJim Shooshttps://gomarcellusshale.com/xn/detail/u_1zmcv26fki85q
<p>Ji... I'll tell you what's a real bummer. Freezing to death in the dark. Water is hard to drink or bathe with when its frozen. Those are real downsides... but you go ahead and pump the enviro side of the equation. </p>
<p>Ji... I'll tell you what's a real bummer. Freezing to death in the dark. Water is hard to drink or bathe with when its frozen. Those are real downsides... but you go ahead and pump the enviro side of the equation. </p> Ok...one downside is that met…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-03-22:2274639:Comment:2594182012-03-22T21:43:39.454Zjihttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/jamesirwin
<div><div id="yiv1420986768"><div id="yui_3_2_0_17_133240454986675"><div class="yui_3_2_0_17_133240454986650" id="yui_3_2_0_17_133240454986676"><div id="yiv1420986768yui_3_2_0_17_133238868649240">Ok...one downside is that methane in your well water can explode and cause a cement pad to go flying into your neighbors yard (Dimock) or blow your house off its foundation and catch fire (Bainbridge). I probably would call that both a fire and health hazard. Another downside is that it is not good to…</div>
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<div><div id="yiv1420986768"><div id="yui_3_2_0_17_133240454986675"><div class="yui_3_2_0_17_133240454986650" id="yui_3_2_0_17_133240454986676"><div id="yiv1420986768yui_3_2_0_17_133238868649240">Ok...one downside is that methane in your well water can explode and cause a cement pad to go flying into your neighbors yard (Dimock) or blow your house off its foundation and catch fire (Bainbridge). I probably would call that both a fire and health hazard. Another downside is that it is not good to breath like when you take a shower or run water or it escapes into your house thru other means because it can make it hard to breath because it's an asphyxiant. To properly remove methane at these levels (57 ppm) from your well water is very expensive to construct and costly to maintain. Another downside (if your not rich).</div>
<div>However, I guess if you know your going to have methane in your well water before it happens and you have enough money and time to construct a treatment system or connect to city water, having methane in your water is less of a hazard and downside. Simply venting your well casing with a vent pipe doesn't do it either, you need to aerate the water which requires underground tanks, pumps and other equipment. On the other hand, air in your well water might cause some pump cavitation but other than that there is probably no downside. Don't know what "cause belli" means in this context.</div>
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</div> Would you say a little more a…tag:gomarcellusshale.com,2012-03-22:2274639:Comment:2591782012-03-22T18:05:59.406ZTom Copleyhttps://gomarcellusshale.com/profile/TomCopley
<p>Would you say a little more about what the downside of having your well "contaminated" with methane is? Methane is a non-toxic, orderless gas that is probably naturally occurring in half the water wells in that area. While it is highly flammable, when properly vented presents very little danger of fire or explosion.</p>
<p>Air is also normally dissolved in water. Would you say that water is "contaminated" with air too? I'm curious about what risks you imply about methane in the water wells.…</p>
<p>Would you say a little more about what the downside of having your well "contaminated" with methane is? Methane is a non-toxic, orderless gas that is probably naturally occurring in half the water wells in that area. While it is highly flammable, when properly vented presents very little danger of fire or explosion.</p>
<p>Air is also normally dissolved in water. Would you say that water is "contaminated" with air too? I'm curious about what risks you imply about methane in the water wells. These infractions cited by DEP are essentially moot unless there is also a <em>cause belli</em>.</p>