Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by lynn on July 27, 2012 at 11:06am

They're near Burghill.  I think he said they offered 3800 and 17%.  They only have 2 or 3 acres.

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Permalink Reply by Steven Kacerski on July 27, 2012 at 2:12pm

What companies that are leasing in trumbull county are offering a true 17% gross royalty?  When you say gross royalty, does that include having no taxes deducted as well?

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Permalink Reply by Steven Kacerski on July 28, 2012 at 12:38am

Fang,

Just to be clear, I was not referring to income taxes.  I was referring to oil & gas production related taxes (ex. severance). If the landowner has to pay a portion of these taxes, then the royalty check won't be gross. 

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Permalink Reply by Steven Kacerski on July 28, 2012 at 6:00am

that works for me. I just wanted to clarify since some people who have never dealt with oil & gas royalty payments may be led to believe no expenses, including taxes, would not be deducted from their royalty check. Thanks for clarifying.

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Permalink Reply by Steven Kacerski on August 1, 2012 at 2:44pm

Dave,

is this a excerpt of your SIF/halcon lease? does the lease address any compensation to landowners if they lose their CAUV exemption and their real estate taxes go up due to oil & gas production on their property?

Permalink Reply by Steven Kacerski on July 27, 2012 at 6:11am

Lynn,

I know they are looking in my area of the county.  I'm not far from the permitted Brugler well site.  From what I have heard, their offer is slightly less than BP's, both signing bonus and royalty percentage. 

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Permalink Reply by lynn on July 27, 2012 at 11:08am

Where's the Brugler well site?  He said it said something about a 'unit' but I would have to ask more.

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Permalink Reply by Steven Kacerski on July 27, 2012 at 2:06pm

burghill.  carrizo is probably looking for land around the well so they can have enough for a unit.

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Permalink Reply by lynn on August 1, 2012 at 10:23am

Thanks Fang.  I'll let my friend know what was talked about here.  Talking to neighbors etc is up to him.

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Permalink Reply by 0i7okn54zwbdo on August 1, 2012 at 5:35pm

That's not true.  Mineral rights can raise the value of a property and a county can choose to increase said value when taxing your property.  Carroll county has been talking about shifting the value of mineral rights from $100/acre to $5,000 and assessing property tax based on those numbers.  Remember, if there's a way for the government to get more money from you, they will find it.

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Permalink Reply by Kenny on August 2, 2012 at 10:51am

I would tell the auditor to pound sand.  How can you tax something that doesn't have a realized value yet?  That oil/gas isn't worth anything until you can get it out of the ground and produce it so if they are trying to tax you based off of un-produced mineral rights then they are trying to get over on you.

We all know that not all areas are created equal when it comes to oil/gas so someone in a less prolific area is going to get taxed at the same rate as somone in a more prolific area, I don't think so.

Again....if they are trying to increase you property taxes due to un-produced minerals then I would fight it and fight it hard.

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Permalink Reply by Steven Kacerski on August 2, 2012 at 2:42am

Property taxes are based upon improvements?  Sounds like you are inferring that land is not factored into the real estate tax equation.  Maybe that's how they do it in the county you live in, but that is not the case in trumbull county. 

CAUV taxes in trumbull county went up this past year.  Some of the increase was due to the increased prices for crops since the last assessment was done.  The taxesis partly determined by soil type.  So if they can raise taxes based on commodity prices and soil types, what would stop them from increasing the assessment based on how productive the shale is if a person leases their property?  Also, if someone has a well put on their property, I wouldn't be surprised if a county auditor would argue that is an improvement to property.

I think this will be an issue. Maybe not all counties, but some counties.  If Kasich wants to get his share of the oil & gas pie, what makes you think local jurisdictions don't want there cut? Looks like Carroll county has already realized that.

I guess long story short, there is more to a lease than the up front lease payments and whether the royalties are "gross" or have deductions applied to them.  There are other areas in these leases, whether it is BP, Halcon, etc. that have real dollars at stake a landowner needs to consider before signing a lease. 

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