Old lease that a company still thinks they have

I signed and got paid on a lease almost 2 years ago. I recently got a letter in the mail from an O&G company saying that they were unaware that the ownership of the interests had changed. I have owned the land for about 13 years. They say that they have a lease from 47 years ago from their predecessor company and that 44 years ago my acreage was included in a drilling unit of 60 acres. They say that the royalties have previously been paid to Mr X. To my knowledge there isn't a well within 60 acres of my land. They are requesting my ss# because the IRS needs it for persons to whom they pay. They included a W2 form for me to fill out and return, saying if I don't they are required to withhold 28% of their payment. I did try to call the company but they said I could only leave a message on a machine and someone would get back to me. They wouldn't let me talk to a person at that time.

Since I'm almost positive there isn't an existing/producing well, I'm not sure what to do with this. Any advice or ideas are great appreciated.

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Permalink Reply by James Foster on October 28, 2013 at 12:45pm

What state? If Ohio you can check online for existing well at ODNR. We had an existing lease/well that was not valid/producing but was not marked released and still listed as producing. Company did make some effort at shenanigans such as bringing a tank out to well swabbing it. We were able to get it taken care of due yo our knowledge we gained at various meetings and from others.

Do not sign anything cash anything or give anyone anything. Get an attorney.

Permalink Reply by RO on October 28, 2013 at 11:56pm
Yes, it is in Ohio.
Permalink Reply by Philip Brutz on October 28, 2013 at 12:56pm

It sounds like a con.  Do not give them your SS#  I would call the police.

Permalink Reply by Nancy Mosley on October 28, 2013 at 3:18pm

You can call the assessor's office in the county where the property is. I think they keep track of wells and royalty property, at least they do in West Virginia. I agree with the advice not to sign anything or give out SS# etc unless you get to the bottom of this. 

If this is WV I might be able to help direct you to places to check this out. If another state, I'll let someone else help; there are a lot of great people on this site, ready to help.

Permalink Reply by caualie on October 28, 2013 at 3:29pm

 I would strongly suggest you have no phone contact with these people what so ever. If you did anything I'd maybe use their return envelope & request the API # of the well they're referring to as well as a copy of the lease they claim to be affecting your property. Keep a copy of any mailings for yourself.As stated above I too suspect fraud. Especially if you signed a lease & were paid. Do not, do not, give these people any personal identification information of any kind !

Permalink Reply by Nancy Mosley on October 28, 2013 at 3:41pm

Another thought: the company who recently contacted you is definitely not the company you signed a lease with, correct? If not, you could ask the company you signed a lease with if they have any knowledge of a well involved with your property. Also, drilling units were not as common 40 years ago so that part sounds fishy too. 

You are getting good advice here. Caualie had good ideas as well as Philip.

Permalink Reply by JR on October 28, 2013 at 4:10pm
We owned our land for 6 years before we found out we had been part of a unit with a crappy producing well located on a neighbors property. The owners, 2 prior to us, had continued collecting the royalties for 9 years undetected. However, the fact we were previously leased came up at a simple title search and we wouldn't have gotten paid had we tried to sign with CHK 3 years ago when this all came to light. Lots of red flags with your situation. Our title search cost $300 and I was told that finding leases in the chain of title is "legal 101". Hopefully you can get this cleared up quickly.
Permalink Reply by James Foster on October 28, 2013 at 4:53pm

Driiling units in Ohio were common 40 years ago. Vertical well units sizes were based on well depth and whether it was a gas or oil well lease. My uncles had leases back 70's that did indicate the drilling unit size. They were not as large as today due to shallower depth and no horizontal drilling.

Permalink Reply by RO on October 29, 2013 at 12:02am
Correct, this is not the same company that I signed a lease with. They did give me an API# but I didn't know what to do with It. Thanks for your help.
Permalink Reply by caualie on October 29, 2013 at 2:15am

 In Ohio you can go on ODNR web site, & with the API #  zoom right in to the exact location of the well in question on their "map viewer". You can get the date it was drilled, who owns it, production history, etc., etc.  However, understand that any shiester wanting to get personally identifiable information can also go to this web site, grab an API # from any well in your vicinity & use it for their con. As far as I know most of the title work done by the O&G's in recent times are pretty darn through & while possible, I doubt they missed your property being held by production, which seems to be what this out of the blue company is saying. Keep everything they send you, but I would not engage them in verbal conversation. Whoever they are I don't think they are concerned about your best interest.

Permalink Reply by Philip Brutz on October 29, 2013 at 2:34am

Try using the ODNR Oil and Gas Well viewer.  Just  zoom in on your land and click on the Identify Button, then click on the well. Then click on the well summary report.

http://www2.dnr.state.oh.us/website/dog/oilgasviewer/index.html

You can also type in the API# into the search window.

Permalink Reply by Summer Johnston on October 29, 2013 at 2:54am

It seems unreasonable to me that an oil/gas company, which would have performed a search on your property to see just exactly who is the actual/current owner of the minerals, would pay you lease money if the lease were held by some other company.

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