Landowner Groups? Thinking about joining one.

Am considering joining a landowner group in western Pa headed by CX Energy. Any input, testimonials, etc.?

Thanks, Jeff.

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Permalink Reply by elliemae82 on January 5, 2013 at 3:19am

Mark,

Thanks for the advice. The more I read the more I'm considering signing with a group. Maybe your group or Buckeye Mineral. What experience do you have in dealing with O&G companies? What kind of lease do you offer? If you don't take a percentage of landowners bonus? Are you being paid by the O&G companies? Thanks again Mark and Happy New Year to you too!

0i7okn54zwbdoPermalink Reply by 0i7okn54zwbdo on December 27, 2012 at 3:52pm

That may be true for many but such a blanket proclamation cannot be made in good faith.  There have been some really great landowner groups that have helped countless landowners.  Not everyone can have proper leverage and a well-run group provides that.  

Permalink Reply by jeff on December 27, 2012 at 5:59pm

Thanx, everyone for all the valuable input so far!  I've been thinkin' a L.O. group should serve sort of like hiring a forester to timber your property. They know the value, have the connections, and how to market, and can keep tabs on the process. I've done that and was very satisfied - counted the fee a good investment. Marcus, or whoever..Question... what makes a well run group?

Jeff.

0i7okn54zwbdoPermalink Reply by 0i7okn54zwbdo on December 28, 2012 at 4:44am

I don't agree with your assessment.  Landowners should never be free to leave the group whenever they want to.  That undermines the whole process.  If the group is holding out and negotiating for something and I decide to take the offer on the table and stiff everyone else what recourse is there for the rest of the folks who followed the rules?  You either stand together or don't bother joining.

Your entire assessment of the way a group would run is counter to literally every group ever.  You're essentially saying that a group should behave as an individual , which is of course impossible.  This is one where we'll have to agree to disagree.

0i7okn54zwbdoPermalink Reply by 0i7okn54zwbdo on December 28, 2012 at 8:20am

I understand where you're coming from and I get why you made those specific points.  It's just hard because there's no way to know if a group is legitimate until you're already pretty far into the process.

0i7okn54zwbdoPermalink Reply by 0i7okn54zwbdo on December 31, 2012 at 10:21am

You make a lot of valid points about this.  It's pretty hard for a landowner to make the right decision, given all the variables.  

Permalink Reply by time will tell on December 28, 2012 at 2:31am

Find a good land group and be patient . The o-g companies want to pick us of one at a time.

Any one who say's different will find out how bad of a mistake they have made .

Research the groups past performance and at the time of a deal have a lawyer that

you trust if there is such a person review the lease .

The buyers will give more if there are more than one to win .

Is CX a producer or a land man driven tool used by the big o-g companies ?

Permalink Reply by Janice L. Hancharick on January 2, 2013 at 11:01am

 Based on earlier replies, regardless of the sign-in handles used, it's obvious  some know what they're talking about and some don't.  As a "newbie" it may be tough to spot the truth when you see it.  I researched CX-Energy when it was referred to as Co-eXprise, Inc..  I also had 3 law firms ... 2 major ones and one local firm to do some of the homework for me ... not totally trusting my own findings.  A  GREAT  DEAL  IS  AT  STAKE beyond #'s and %'s when leasing one's land.

I learned that the company's history has always been tied to Energy.  Marketing and negotiating deals for a long list of clients that everyone recognizes ...  Heinz, Ford, Kellogg, District of Columbia, Burlington ... The list is long but the point is --- energy is needed by everyone and everyone wants the best price.  On the supply side we want the $$ high.  On the consumer side a low price suits everyone.  Experience in making deals happen in the energy world definitely counts, and when it comes with a solid reputation for putting the client first it means CX  listens.

 You're thinking of joining a group for 6 months at no cost to you, so that a large experienced firm with long established contacts throughout the energy world can strive to bring you and the other group members a good deal.  If you end up not getting paid,  they won't get paid either and all their work hours will have been for nothing.  BUT you will still have control of your land.

I would say "Good Luck", but it doesn't take luck.  Smart decisions are made with careful thought and trustworthy counsel.

Permalink Reply by Janice L. Hancharick on January 2, 2013 at 4:55pm

I understand what you're saying, and when groups form it is logical in my mind that for an entire county it's possible not all acreage would be leased under the same deal at the same time.  I've studied many geological charts focused on numerous layers @ different angles for our Marcellus region, and one thing is for certain ... differences exist within a few miles radius.  At any given time that makes one formation more marketable than another.  That also allows some holding storage leases to lease Marcellus/Utica layers (shallow and not tight formation) while others cannot, i.e. tighter , deeper formation meaning gas under great pressure .... drillers go away!

All businesses must make a profit. Gas/oil will lease where they will get the most bang for their buck at that time.  It doesn't mean they won't be back.  It's happened on more than one occasion.

I politely disagree with your last statement only because the CX firm was paid a % of the upfront money only from the landowners whose acres were leased.  When CX is able to secure mutually agreeable leases for the "so-far"unleased, then they'll get paid after the remaining portion of the landowners get paid.

All this better be worth everyone's time!

 I hate it when  a repairman comes to fix something, I pay him, and a few days later he has to be called back for the same problem. I have to pay him twice!

Permalink Reply by Janice L. Hancharick on January 2, 2013 at 5:09pm

Jeff,

You're wise to recognize the cut-throat tactics gas/oil companies (and land agents) subject the public to when it suits them.  Time and again they've been taken to court ... state supreme courts! ... and seldom do individuals or groups of individuals win.  What does come out of such disagreements though is negative publicity for the gas/oil conglomerates.  They are getting more sensitive to that.  AMEN.

From what I've gleaned these past few years CX has acted like a watchdog, coming between bad deals between gas/oil companies and  CX clients ... stopping bad deals before they happen.  They've been in business long enough to know who most of the "nasties" are, and how to write and market a lease without loopholes.

It is possible to get a fair lease, one that both sides of the table can feel good about. Liken it to buying a car, but much more intricate.  Neither side wants a lemon!

Permalink Reply by jeff on January 2, 2013 at 5:24pm

Janice,

Are you a geologist or something?  I'd like to see some of those charts (or have someone read them for me). What I've found so far from PSU, the Marcellus is 150-200' thick and 7k' deep under my property in lower Indiana county,Pa, with a 450' thick Utica another 5-7k' deep. No indication of angular differences.

Thanx, Jeff.

Permalink Reply by Janice L. Hancharick on January 2, 2013 at 8:22pm

I expect I fit the "or something" category. There are numerous sites beyond PSU that comment on Marcellus/Utica geology, show maps at different angles, mature and immature formations, etc..  When it gets too technical I reach out to "real geologists" for a deeper understanding, then attempt to get the word out in common language to those who are interested.  Drillers and other workers in the field, plus professionals connected to the industry provide me with a great deal of meaningful info. A working knowledge of everything connected to Marcellus would give one analysis paralysis just trying to put it all together and searching out a good lease.  ...another good reason for signing on with a  group.  I used my background as an educator, a member of a drilling family going way back up and to the 80's, a wealth of "boots to the ground" contacts (blue and white collar) who deal with today's shale happenings, and my passion for research before deciding to join a group.

You are in an excellent area.  The CX firm has a keen understanding of what's there, companies that are interested, and which ones are the most reliable to work with.  Call them up and ask questions relevant to your situation.  You'll like what you hear or you won't.

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