AGGREGATING ACRES IN COUNTY-WIDE GROUPS

Putting several large OGM holdings together to  market as production units for shale fracking in more than one shale layer is smart business for landowners and companies alike.  In spite of the better leases ($$$'s and protections) achieved by the landowners, companies also come out ahead using technology and single action deals for thousands of acres without creating "bad press".  In case you haven't noticed, creating "bad press" isn't in any company's best interest.  County-wide landowner groups have become "the norm" in recent years ... different from smaller groupings of landowners within a township.

Seeking the most for the least and can easily be achieved when dealing with a small group, but with minimal lease benefits for the landowners.  If Leasing By Itself is all a few landowners are looking for then going this route may be a temporary fix for immediate financial problems. It's unfortunate when people find themselves in this fix, but there are always companies willing to help these folks out.

Misunderstood by some is the concept that a county-wide group will be able to deliver the same $$$ for all townships simultaneously just because of it's size. Companies definitely look @ size, but also important to them is each townships geology and infrastructure, and the depth of company pockets in a specific business quarter.  What product from the well will be most marketable when the well reaches completion ... a time frame that may not be a long as it would seem?

The point here: county-wide groups achieve more for their members due to size, but the time-frame is likely to differ from one collection of 3-4 townships to the neighboring group of townships. AGAIN it is the geology, the infrastructure, and the market that drives the timeframe of a deal.  

County groups choose to highlight the best their regions have to offer, including the population's pro-drilling attitude when leases are environmentally and owner friendly. If this massive marketing effort isn't done by experienced firms with an established footprint in the energy industry, then resources won't reach their full potential to improve landowners and a region's financial future.  Whether a person's acreage is sitting atop a diamond field, a gold mine, or natural gas/oil deposits, not having it marketed and developed the best way possible is simply a waste on so many levels.

This is why county groups are formed & how they deliver.

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Permalink Reply by p umpjack on July 6, 2013 at 2:56pm

Fine print correct   masked whats behind that print  ......

C'mon go herd cats you two.....arm twisting to sign a deal really???

HOW ABOUT TENTS AND CLOWNS AND.... WAIT YOU HAVE DONE THAT FOR MASS SIGNINGS................

CX has "in-house" legal persons, but a piece of the $$ pie the firm earns also goes to regional O&G law firms who best know the area being leased ...

So how is that legal piece of the pie being served in mercer?

 

Halcon also alleged fraud in that Morascyzk and Polochak and Co-eXprise “modified one of the contractual documents in such a way that (landowners) were unable to lease their gas rights to Halcon.

Permalink Reply by Norm Kozlowski on July 18, 2013 at 8:51am

Bob,

 I think you are right on the money all the above mention is a way to sucker the landowner into a pie in the sky scenario, I understand that Janice has to make a living but give me a break in western pa. thousands of acres were tied up by these so-called marketing groups and swepi refused to deal with them. 

 

Permalink Reply by Billy Park Whyde on July 4, 2013 at 2:44am

Janice I am a land owner I had posted "Oh please, "It's unfortunate when people find themselves in this fix, but there are always companies willing to help these folks out." Hip wader time, na make that chest waders!

  You portray the O&G companies to be our friends, that is bull. They are in business to make money the more the better at the landowners expense if necessary. Might I have missed where the O&G companies are handing out free grants or very low interest rate loans to those that might be in financial distress, NO!  

 If the O&G companies were on the side of the land owners they would not deal with flippers, but rather deal directly with landowners. 

Permalink Reply by Craig on July 4, 2013 at 2:29pm

Actually, BPW, I think Janice was referring to the fact that if people are in distress and need a lease quickly, there are plenty of companies out there willing to lease them.  Or, maybe she meant there are plenty of marketing companies out there willing to help them out.  It was unclear from the context of the paragraph which was the object of the phrase you referrence.

I know who Janice is, however, and believe me, she does not desire to paint the O&G co's as a benevolent bunch of folks. 

She does however push the land group concept, and works for CX Energy, a "marketer" They do not pay any leases, are not an oil and gas company, nor an operator in any state.  They just get landowners to sign an 18 month exclusive agreement that states that they cannot sign a lease without CX, but that CX will not act as their attorneys, but they give the impression at the meetings that they are doing just that, but then cover their assets with language in the agreement.

She has also stated in the thread here, that the landowner does not have to sign the lease that CX presents and negotiates, but the agreement states otherwise - that the landowner is obligaated to sign, so I am not reall sure how it is different that dealing with an O&G company, seeing as they both are tryign to enrich themselves. 

Granted, the marketers do line up a bit more with the landowner, yet, I have seen it enough times to be sick of it - the marketers tell people to wait, it will get better, but what they really want to do is con-vince the landowner to hang with them while they gather more acreage so they can line their own pockets with 6-10% for doing little of nothing.  And, in the meantime, the companies come by trying to lease, people shun the O&G companies, and then when the marketer has "enough" acreage, they begin to market, but the frenzy has past, and now they have no lease, no monies, and an exclusive agreement that they cna't get out of - sounds like an O&G company that comes in, leases land, doesn't pay, and holds leases while they try to sell them, no? 

Same deal, but one is not an O&G company so they (marketers) can call the O&G co. a big, bad, lying, wolf, when, seriously, think about it - they are both attorney-sleazeballs that get better people to be their fronts and they sit back and line their pockets.

Sorry for a few misspelled words.

I at least have some respect for the O&G that do come in and pay leases, then later sell or develop and sell - they at least get in the game and risk something, when the marketers have no risk.

Permalink Reply by Janice L. Hancharick on July 6, 2013 at 4:33am

It's a non-happening that all of us will be on the same page (figuratively) @ the same time, but I definitely disagree with some of Craig's statements simply because they were true but are no longer. The CX contract I'm familiar with is a 6 month document.  It is self-renewing for another 6 mos. unless the OGM holder sends a letter to Wexford (home office) requesting the contract become null and void.  Signing a lease that is not pleasing to the owner is NOT mandatory!  In the beginning when CX was first chosen to represent 4-County (it's not the first representation the group had) contracts and leases had different wording than the present.  It's a no-brainer that such things must change to reflect the growth of the whole business.  Changes abound and just keeping up is not enough ... not for businesses ... not for individuals.  Without crystal balls both must still look to the future, plan, then adjust.

6%-10% of what for pocket-lining???  I'm aware that individuals signing a contract before a lease deal is complete are setting aside 6% of the upfront money for CX.  Also that "johnny-come-lately's" pay 8% of the upfront money for their lease.  0% comes off the royalty for CX  whether a well lasts for 5 years or 50 years.  Incidentally who calls  money earned a lining of the pocket?

It would be foolish to paint O&G companies as benevolent, or to begrudge them a profit for their contribution to society world-wide.  The public has come to realize that some energy companies are more conscientious than others, and certainly wish to do business with them over the "other kind". However without proper representation and multiple production unit sized holdings, how strong a negotiating stance exists?

CX has "in-house" legal persons, but a piece of the $$ pie the firm earns also goes to regional O&G law firms who best know the area being leased ... including the history of old lease deals that may slow down individual payments. Specific changes that need to be inserted in general group leases ARE  ADDRESSED. This is a group that wants PA's shale boom to continue ... not at breakneck speed but with solid forward momentum that will positively impact us now and generations to come.  

Enriching oneself for an individual usually means working to make a living. Businesses of ANY type must also enrich themselves, otherwise who would have a job?  Who would be able to pay for a service or a product?

Hopefully after reading through this thread, readers' minds have also been enriched.  That they are curious enough to attend a group meeting.  All kinds of groups have come together to advance audience knowledge.  Penn State's Marcellus Center for Outreach & Research (MCOR) continues to do a fantastic job educating the public on all things Marcellus and Utica. I encourage rights owners to attend in person or online, the next several shale meetings and/or webinars to learn more.

Advancing knowledge, finding the right financial path for those wanting a solid and safe lease ... this is what has been going on in Potter & McKean counties in PA ... Cattaraugus and Allegany counties in NY.  

Float along ... buy a lottery ticket .... or attend a meeting to learn more about the biggest NEW ( and "Yes, old.") industry that we didn't have to coax to come to our region.  It's been under our feet all the time.

Permalink Reply by Jim Litwinowicz on July 6, 2013 at 10:51am

Hey Bob; say you need quadruple bypass surgery on your heart. A cardio intern cracks open your chest and gets you prepped.  The chief cardiologist surgeon comes in. spends about and hour and a half doing the bypasses, then leaves for the intern to close your chest and finish up. Are you gonna whine that he charges $10,000 to $20,000 for 90 minutes of "actual amount of work required"? Probably....lol

But most people would gladly pay for his training, expertise and experience. Cx has experienced attorneys, experienced negotiators, and a solid track record of getting offers above and beyond what individuals were getting from landmen and company reps at that time.

Permalink Reply by Jim Litwinowicz on July 6, 2013 at 3:29pm

ok Bob try this one since the other was too complicated for ya....You wanna sell yer house, want to get $150,000 for it.  But you don't want to use a realtor because they charge 6% for little "actual amount of work required" so you put up a sign in the yard that says "For Sale by Owner"  You talk to a few people, run an ad or two, and wait, and wait. 

Then an agent knocks on your door and says he knows a Texas gadzillionaire that will pay $200,000 dollars for your house.  Just one catch...you have to use that agent and he charges 10%.  Would you say "That means you get $20,000 for hardly any "actual amount of real work required" and toss him out and ignore the $180,000 you would have made. 

I am betting you would. After all, that agent is just some evil "for profit" capitalistic pig.  We all know "profit " is an evil thing. Can't have any profit being made here, Gosh oh golly!

Permalink Reply by the two of us on July 6, 2013 at 4:45pm
Experanced atty's ?? Then please tell us how all
Those landowners with your contract got screwed?
Permalink Reply by p umpjack on July 6, 2013 at 4:47pm

So Diamond Jim.... by this scenario if I do not sign with you and Janice the chances of me surviving a quadruple channel partner cx boondoggle attack I am better off carving myself up with a pen knife

 

hhmmmmm     experienced attorneys with a solid track record ...record of what going to court- why on god's oil filled earth would I want a attorney who gets sued by the people he herded into signing with c-x and m-p

are those crack lawyers still negotiating the foxburg dinner bet?  oh that's right.........its still tied up up with M&P C_X lawsuit in mercer.......

Permalink Reply by p umpjack on July 6, 2013 at 3:02pm

Go to a meeting? sounds like Amway...

saw it been to one fluff and pressure no substance kinda like mt Jackson 4 group results a lot of noise and lawyers making money

Permalink Reply by Janice L. Hancharick on July 7, 2013 at 4:17am

SPECIAL NOTE TO READERS:  This particular topic has obviously hit a nerve, and raised a bone of contention between strong O & G company advocates, and those who are considering joining an OGM rights holders' group in whatever region they are located.

It has not brought out the best in these anti-group individuals, but it has brought out their typical rhetoric. You are being asked to avoid meetings. Don't follow any webinars or look @ the countless materials on the subject whether published by Penn State's Marcellus Center for Outreach & Research, Oil & Gas Journal, Penn Energy, or PIOGA's publication etc.. All of these sources share an incredible amount of  information! Rather than study a topic from several angles you are being asked to run away or wait for the "door-knocker" w/company lease in hand. Forget what groups have done for rights holders. Does this sound logical to you?  Want a fast deal? -OR-  Want a good deal? Be a member, a client, or a naysayer.               You decide ... with your mind, your conscience, and your eyes on the future.

**This is a site where readers should be able to log on and learn. Sadly it's often deteriorated to the "Huff 'n Puff Society for Negativity" on any subject broached that asks readers to think for themselves and make the best choice for their circumstances.  This is what has happened with this discussion.  

Permalink Reply by Jim Litwinowicz on July 7, 2013 at 4:47am

Yeah, pumper  where's my $200 dollar Foxburg dinner.  You claim to be the high ethics, solid moral one here but you make a bet and then don't pay up when ya lose.  Do you work for Halcon???? You lost the bet fair and square. Long past time to pay up.

I'll make it easy on ya. Instead of meeting me or mailing it to me, just go to the restaurant in Foxburg and buy a gift certificate in my name and leave it there for me. That way you won't have to see my ugly face or hear me gloat in any way, And you won't have to  lose your anonymity which you seem to cherish so you can to continue to cowardly snip at people behind some fake name.

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