Where is the first place to look for a pooled unit map- Carroll Co.?
Where would the first place be to look for a map of the pooled unit for a very recently permitted well?
The well is Gartrell, Amsterdam Rd., Carroll Co. (Top of Hagerstown Hill) The well was just permitted and just appeared on the list yesterday.
Any help would be greatly appreciated. Time is at a premium with CHK mandating lease signings by tomorrow noon. (Basic boilerplate, 500' setback, no drill, no injection wells, no pipeline)
Thank you!
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Dark Sonnet on
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Thank you for the suggestion. Nothing recent.
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Permalink Reply by Kathleen on -
I hope CHK is just playing a game and that threat does not hold true for you. Their last investor call did say though that only 10% of monies will now go to leases so I would be concerned if you don't plan on being a hold out and wait for them to need you. Last year they said after the 1st quarter they would not be leasing as they have and that seemed to come true.
I'm not sure if a well that just got permitted would have a unit drawing yet. They can change it and add other wells for months before it gets drilled and producing or shut in.
I'm not sure if you are trying to see if they already included you in a unit (yup they do that without you being leased early in the well developement). If that is what you are looking to find out just call CHK customer service. Have your parcel number ready and name your county and just ask them. If they ask for a lease ID just say you never saw that. The customer service people from what I can tell don't know if you are leased or not by just looking at your parcel number in your county. They told me they only see the parcel numbers, no names on the maps. I've called twice now once for myself and I'm leased but honestly never saw a lease Id number and once for an unleased neighbor. Both calls were treated the same. The hold time can be very long but hang In there since they do pick up or you may get lucky and only have to wait a minute or two.
The excuse we used to do these calls was we said we got water testing paper work and wanted to know did that mean we were in a unit or just within a certain distance to need the testing done.
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I totally agree with your analysis about the decline in CHK leasing program for Carroll. Actually during the call I believe he (McClendon) promised shareholders to quickly shift from land acquisitions to a "harvesting" phase. It isn't that I am attempting to hold out, it is just that I am not convinced that I want any part of a lease, especially the boilerplate that I have been presented with.
I was interested in seeing the placement of the pooling unit on the land, hopefully to give some clarity to try and approximate the likelyhood of being included. The permit is for an 8H (SE lateral) and of course, would also be dependent on the size of the production unit.
We are only dealing with an acre of land and trying to factor whether in the long run, it would really be worth it. Also, if adjoining land owners are not leasing, does it really matter if you have a lease?
Am I right in assuming that an 8H would be an outside right lateral? Also, great reminder on the water testing 1000' distance. Another landowner received a water testing notice and I couldn't figure out how he would be included given the direction, angle, etc. However, it is like dealing with smoke and mirrors at this point and I am an analytical type of being more comfortable weighing out pros and cons.
Thank you so much for the reply and I will try calling as you suggested! I was under the misapprehension that they filed a pooling drawing with the permit so now onto Plan B.
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Permalink Reply by Kathleen on
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I sure don't blame you for wanting nothing to do with that type of lease especially for an acre. When I said hold out I didn't mean that in any negative way. Especially with an acre I would want to be in there way and hope for a great lease one day attached to a check worth your time.
Did you receive water test paper work? I'm pretty sure the customer service number isn't going to be able to tell you the likelihood of being in a production unit since as is was explained to me they just see the drawing and the parcel numbers included, but hey you never know. They may be able to tell you if you are close though to the lines in the drawing and as DBD said these drawing can change. I wish you the best.
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Oh, I didn't take it as being said in a negative way! I am really appreciative of your candor and the assistance that you have offered, believe me!
I did not receive water test paper work, but one of the other landowners who is about 2/3 mile away has had his water tested. But as you mentioned before, there isn't any way to know if it was for being in the pooling unit or the 1000' restriction.
I will try calling DNR again tomorrow - for now I believe I hold the record for being on hold and disconnected...;o)
Yes, everything is subject to change, sometimes on a very frequent basis and I guess as with a lot of things in life, you just have to fly by the seat of your pants at times.
If I had more land, a little more time to research the issues and something other than a boilerplate lease, I might feel differently. I just got my copy of the lease on Sat. although I had seen one of the other landowners completed lease about a week or so ago. Then the edict about the signing deadline for tomorrow noon was delivered a few days later. And for about 300-350 a month (hypothetically) and probably much less after all the cost deductions, would it be worth dealing with Chesapeake, etc. $64,000 question that really isn't answerable right now.
Thanks again for your most welcome insight and the call suggestion. It was much appreciated!
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The information: Gartrell 23-13-6 8H, api#34019221560100. I don't know if I am doing something wrong or if the info isn't up yet. After the api#, ending at a blank page that indicates Completion Report..
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There is another SURE group in Carroll co., and they may take your one acre since you already received a lease offer from Chesapeake. That would hopefully be a better lease, anyway. With the current situation of Ches., I don't know what the outcome of the group will be, but it could be worth a try.
We are in a similar situation to yours. Small acreage, and Ches. wanted to offer us pretty good money to sign a very one-sided lease. We decided not to sign, and are currently unsure what to do. Many of our neighbors have signed, I think. Like you, we aren't really trying to "hold out", but we just want a halfway fair lease.
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It is really difficult to know what to do in these situations. Do you know exactly how it is handled if the person next to you does not sign a lease and you do? With the situation with CHK financial difficulties, which seem to get worse each day and their joint venture partner TOTAL taking over more of their leases, there are so many unknowns to deal with. Then adding the deadline really ramps things up.
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As far as I know nothing happens if you sign and your neighbor doesn't. We signed back in February after most of our neighbors had already signed One neighbor bordering our land still has not signed and probably never will. I suggest you present ches with the SURE lease and tell them you will sign that. It is a good lease.
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I really don't know what happens if our neighbors have signed and we haven't. Our landman has, of course, mentioned that there could be force pooling. I have read the forced pooling information, and it says that the oil and gas company must make a reasonable effort (or something like that) to lease your land. I wonder if a reasonable effort means offering you their lease, and their terms, and being unwilling to negotiate the lease terms. Also, I wonder if our state would really tell us that we have to lease our land to a company that has as many financial issues as Chesapeake does right now. I wonder...
Also, I don't like the deadline thing. If, as they say, they are going to be in the area and drilling for the next 15 or more years, then there is no reason that they are not going to be leasing any more land after today. That doesn't make any sense. It seems to me to just be a threat, and I don't like threats.
And, you signing your lease today still doesn't mean that you will get the bonus and the lease. They still have their 90 days or more to decide if they want your land.
These are just some of my feelings as we try to sort through the same issues that you are.
I wish you the best as you decide what to do.
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I wonder how they handle this issue when developing production units. Force Pooling is the most misused tool the landmen use. Some of their "versions" can be quite "interesting".
From talking to a person from ODNR, every effort is to be made to come up with a reasonable lease agreeable to both parties. It (FP) can only be used 5 times a year and each time an o/g company wants to file for it, they first have to pay a $5000. fee, prove with paperwork that they have made multiple reasonable offers to you that have been refused, and that without your land they have no reasonable alternative to form a production unit. Forced Pooling was never intended to be used in this type of situation. It was designed for more urban areas where one holdout could prevent a unit from happening.
I understand that the companies were told by the governors office at the beginning of some of the heavier leasing efforts NOT to use Forced Pooling in their pitches of what would happen if landowners did not sign a lease. I was informed recently that there is a reporting system in place to call, name the landman and the company he represents.
Chesapeake is in such a mess and in his Monday call with shareholders, McClendon promised them that he had moved out of the leasing phase and into the "harvesting" phase and until the financials were addressed he would do only necessary leasing. CHK's joint venture partner TOTAL S.A. (French gov. company) is already increasing their stake and taking over CHK leases in Guernsey, plus footing the bills for the current drilling.
Yes, you are correct. No guarantee on the lease until it moves through the land dept. and gets approved.
I guess it somewhat comes down to a risk/reward balance when deciding this lease issue. So do you hold your nose and sign and dance with the devil, or just walk away? I also find the deadlines offensive, as you do.
In the end it just comes down to dealing with the here and now or gambling on the future. It is like a poker game where you are asked to bet your hand but you don't know the value of what is in the pot...
Thank you for the good wishes and the same right back to you!
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