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Permalink Reply by Rick on August 6, 2013 at 8:26am

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Permalink Reply by 0i7okn54zwbdo on August 7, 2013 at 1:48am

How can anyone take this clown seriously after all the crap he's pulled?

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Permalink Reply by 0i7okn54zwbdo on August 7, 2013 at 3:06am

This guy would have made a killing in the pre-internet days when information wasn't so easily accessed.

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Permalink Reply by Des Wertheimer on August 7, 2013 at 11:09am

This is Des.

This is not a bad lease at all. Seriously, the unit clause you are talking about does allow a vertical well to hold 160 acres, but the lateral clause is built around the idea of the unit size is based on the length of the lateral. Believe we actually know what we are talking about here. As for the other parts of the lease. This company is paying $6400 an acre. The highest negotiated price ever paid to a group not only in Ohio but in the entire Appalachian Basin. I have read every lease that is out there, and our lease is as good or better.

People actually think that their leases give them their shallow rights or their deep rights to sell to someone else. The real question is, has anyone actually made a dime selling other so called formations. The answer is no. I actually know how this works. And to you Donna, you do not have a clue what your talking about.

1. a single well can only hold 1650 acres if they drill a lateral more than 9000 feet. So to hold that many acres, they actually have to drill the lateral that far. For those of you who want the truth, it states 640 plus 10% up to 7000 lateral, 1000 acres up to 8000 foot lateral and so on. This means the farther they push the lateral the larger they can make the unit. This is actually to your benefit because not every foot of shale is profitable. And there is no way you can drill a 3 well unit with laterals longer than 5500 on 640 acres. So, Donna your wrong.

2. Your claim that they can pull up a dozer and hold the property is false. May be you cannot read, so here is the clause under definitions. : 

(a) Operations.            “Operations” shall be defined as Lessee having secured a drilling permit from the State of Ohio Division of Oil and Gas and further entering upon the herein described premises with equipment necessary to build any access road(s) for the drilling of a well subsequently followed by the drilling rig for the well to be drilled.

As you can see it says to be subsequently followed by a drilling rig for the well to be drilled.

3. The shut in clause is what it is. People want everything and see every clause as a money making venture. Remember, shut in on activates is the well is drilled and completed and SHUT IN. So do you actually think that a company is going to spend  8 million a well and shut it in for kicks and giggles. Lets be reasonable. In the end, are there other contracts that have a better clause on shut in, yes, but you cant have it all and there lease have lots of holes in them.

4. yep to vertical pugh which isn't the end of the world. An area that no one wanted 3 months ago is getting the HIGHEST PRICE EVER PAID IN OHIO. We have to give a little bit, but maybe Donna lives in a world where she gets everything her way.

5 A deposit Wrong, it is a signing payment given at the signing as a good faith gesture to the landowner. it is $1000.00 per parcel unless your consideration is less than $1000.00 then it is $100.00. Has anyone ever negotiated a payment at signing other than $10.00. Nope. So the clown was able to get people walking money at signing. and a $1000.00 is still a thousand dollars and it is per parcel.

6. Termination. If the lease terminates, then if the company doesn't respond to a request of release, if one isn't already granted after ninety days then any affidavit filed is binding on them. what this really means, is if the lease is terminated, and the company doesnt release you automatically, after 90 days an affidavit can be filed and it is binding wiith the company having no recourse. That isn't so bad. If there is a termination, so if there is not a termination, this doesn't come into to play at all. But we included the 90 day limit because a lot of leases out there have no limit on time. So again, whats the problem here.

7 Market enhancement. People do not understand this at all. So let me explain this one again. People think that a gross at the wellhead is the way to go to get the most money. WRONG!!!!!. Gross at the wellhead means just that. At the wellhead. Most of the real value is with the products that they enhance the wet gas into. If you don't have a market enhancement clause, you are not entitled to the enhanced value that comes from it. The clause states, that if they enhance the product for more value, then we share proportionately in the costs as long as they are based on actual cost and in the end we get the same price the oil company gets. So, you think Gross is the way to go without enhanced value then go that way, but you wont be getting any of the enhanced money that oil company gets.

8. Your correct on the pad fee, but no company is going to build a 50 acre pad. You are an idiot. Lets be real

Lets talk about some other things in the lease

Distance from the pad to structure is 500 feet FROM THE EDGE OF THE PAD!! First lease ever ot include distance measured from edge of pad.  No gas storage  and no injection. No use of surface water.

Water testing at 1000 from wellhead..

Fencing requirements, pipelines at 48 inches, not the typical 36.

And a strong Indemnification clause.

Is this a perfect lease. Nope, there is no such thing. Do I know what Im talking about. Absolutely. Those complaining on here probably signed some piece of garbage lease or are trying to pass themselves off as an expert. Ive never heard of them holding a meeting, paying for printing, or all the costs associated with the process. I would love to meet them anywhere at anytime and debate them on any topic oil and gas related. I would eat them alive. So get over it. As for the Monroe county lease with Consol, great lease no, but the lease started at 6 or 8 pages when we started and was 16 when we were done. The offer was the offer, people could take it or not. Some did and some didn't, and they took 200 more per acre and signed a lease that was a total mess.

So in the end, money mattered more than anything.

Here you get the highest price ever negotiated and a really great lease.

Your right about the internet with one thing. Some people can hide behind it and say whatever they want and pass it off as truth. Never leave their basement and throe cheap shot after shot. I put myself out their, held dozens of meetings and negotiated not my 4th large deal. So if you want the truth about this lease, come on out to Union Local on Friday or Saturday and see if this isn't a lease you would sign.

Des Wertheimer 3***********

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Permalink Reply by 0i7okn54zwbdo on August 7, 2013 at 3:09pm

" Believe we actually know what we are talking about here."

First time for everything, right?

"Is this a perfect lease. Nope, there is no such thing. Do I know what Im talking about. Absolutely. "

You want people to believe that you know what the terms of the lease say and yet you demonstrate that you don't even have a passing knowledge of the English language.  Questions end in question marks, Des.  But I'd totally trust you with my land, my family's future and a long term income stream.

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Permalink Reply by 0i7okn54zwbdo on August 7, 2013 at 3:21pm

"Your right about the internet with one thing. Some people can hide behind it and say whatever they want and pass it off as truth. Never leave their basement and throe cheap shot after shot. I put myself out their, held dozens of meetings and negotiated not my 4th large deal."

Somewhere your English teacher is crying.  And "not your 4th large deal"?  How did the other three go?

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Permalink Reply by Harry E. Rose on August 8, 2013 at 1:27am

MG, Great River, is this a shell company or what? I googled it and did not come up with anything.

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Permalink Reply by 0i7okn54zwbdo on August 8, 2013 at 2:11am

That's the rumor.  I don't know so I won't speculate.

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Permalink Reply by The Hiker on August 7, 2013 at 12:56pm

First, let me say I agree with some of what Des says.....I personally don't care about vertical pugh clauses, $10 "down" is a typical rate,  market enhancement is a good thing and notification by the landowner is also typical lease language (I don't like it either, but it is typical).   I've read a lot of leases also.  However,  a 9000' lateral would only need 252.5 acres mol (not 1650) according to conventional practice and State requirements.  This is a clause designed to hold acreage.

Subsequently is an adverb based on the following:

Definition of SUBSEQUENT

: following in time, order, or place

Strictly speaking, subsequently could mean 5 minutes, or it could mean 10 years before the rig follows.  Poor language.  Not specific.  Open to interpretation.

 

The worst piece is the shut-in clause IMHO.   3 years and $15/acre after a year stinks.   Things happen.  I agree, these guys don't drill wells just to hold your acreage, but things happen.

 

Finally, name calling reduces any respect I may have had for you, Des.   Don't get personal, address the questions as you did, and comment on the statements and opinions for the readers on this site.   Take 10 deep breaths before you answer.   Walk around the block.  If you want to get personal, take it off line.

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Permalink Reply by Des Wertheimer on August 7, 2013 at 1:12pm

I would respectfuly disagree on the 252.5 acres for a 9000 foot lateral. Remember spacing requires 500 feet on each side. We have had counsel involved in this negotiation and they have more than 80 years legal ecperience in oil and gas. We agreed to the acreage calculation and if you see what is happening in the industry, longer laterals is the name of the game. Also, the clause has a calculation to it, so you take the lateral length and put it in the clause and it gives you the allowable unit size. This has been used in many states for a while and is widely accepted as an accurate and fair way to calculate unit sizes.

As for shut ins, they are what they are. Nothing is perfect.

AS for name calling, I was refering to myself as the clown because one of the repsonders called me a clown. I dont believe I called anyone names. Yeah, from time to time taking a walk first maybe a better judgement, but when it comes to me, I never duck the tough questions and tell things how it is. Feelings on the sleeve are hard at times, but I got into this business to genuinely help people with my knowledge and they continually attack attack attack. No good deed goes unpunished. I have taken a beating on this site for 2 years and sometimes it just gets old. Thanks for the kind criticism.

 

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Permalink Reply by Des Wertheimer on August 7, 2013 at 2:27pm

The timer clause actually is poorly written in the landowners favor. It doesnt allow for the oil company to remove the timber, it just says for notification to be given 45 days before.

The lease doesnt speak of pipelines because it is not part of this negotiation. Right of ways are a separate issue for the landowner to take up.

Containment, please you come at me with containment.

Crop damage, seriously

Force Majuere, not matter the limitations put on this, state law trumps any contract between landowners and oil company,

So please before you go spouting off at the mouth about things you couldnt possibly understand,oh forget it. It isnt worth the time or energy.

Overall it is a great lease with a comapny that has vast experience with its people in drilling know how and the ability to raise a ton of cash. WE are expecting 15000 acres or more to sign so if you think something better or this perfect make believe lease is coming along, its not.

Union Local Middle School

Friday and Saturday from 11-8.

 

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Permalink Reply by 0i7okn54zwbdo on August 7, 2013 at 3:18pm

"I would respectfuly disagree on the 252.5 acres for a 9000 foot lateral. Remember spacing requires 500 feet on each side."

I drew it out, pushing the spacing past 500' to 600' on all sides of the lateral.  I ran a 10,500' lateral and the unit size was 529 acres.  So 1,650 is too high by a factor of 3.  Care to explain?

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