Lease not valid unless a notary is present?

Does anyone know about the lawsuit in Trumbull county about a Notary not being present with Chesapeake when signing a lease.

 

See the below article in the Farm and Diary.

 

http://www.farmanddairy.com/news/trumbull-county-lawsuit-notary-pre...

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Permalink Reply by Utica Watcher on December 18, 2014 at 3:20pm

Ron I would respectfully disagree.  A notary's job is to certify that that the person who is signing the document is actually the person they are signing for.  Many documents are signed without a notary being present.  However, that document if signed without a notary present, must be taken to a notary and have the signers provide proof of their identity and they must attest that the signature is theirs and signed of their own free will (they weren't forced to sign).

A notary need not be present according to Ohio Notary rules.

How's this for a whopper:  Did you know that a document can be notarized by a notary who has had their term expire, and that the document still remains as a validly signed document?  Link below:

http://codes.ohio.gov/orc/147.12

Permalink Reply by Trapper on December 24, 2014 at 10:56am
BINGO! Me either Tim.
This topic has been covered a few times. Both of my leases were done by a landman who is also a notary.
Permalink Reply by Ken Marx on December 19, 2014 at 5:49am
Jim - excellent answer
Permalink Reply by Chris on December 19, 2014 at 5:36am

Doesn't make sense to invalidate the lease. A notary is only required to be able to file a document in the public records, people sign contracts everyday without a notary required and they are all valid. Might be some fluke of Ohio law here but I'm sure this will get overturned.

Permalink Reply by RAY RATELL on December 19, 2014 at 12:48pm

I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW IF A LEASE THAT WAS MADE HAD XXXXX OUT PARAGRAPHS AND WERE NOT INITIALED IS THIS CONTRACT LEGAL?

ALSO IF THE LAND LEASED WAS OWNED BY THE HUSBAND AND WIFE AND ONLY THE HUSBAND SIGNED THE AGREEMENT WOULD IT BE LEGAL? BUT THE WIFE DID SIGN THE LEASE.

NEXT THING IF THE LEASED WELL WAS IN PRODUCTION AND THE PRODUCER STOPED PAYING THE ROYALTIES FOR OVER 2 YRS AND WE SENT THEM A FORFITURE OF WELL DUE TO NOT PAYING, AND ALSO SAID THAT THE WELL CAN NOT BE COMMERCIAL BECAUSE IT CAN NOT PAY THE OVER HEAD, COULD THE LEASE BE HELD BY THE PRODUCER?

Permalink Reply by Chris on December 20, 2014 at 6:07am

I'm not familiar with Ohio law but in Texas you would file an Affidavit of Non-Production stating that the well has not produced in paying quantities since such and such a date and that would be sufficient to kill the old lease.

Permalink Reply by RAY RATELL on December 19, 2014 at 1:06pm

IF YOU SIGNED THE LEASE AND BOTH PARTIES NAMES ARE ON, IT THEN YOU SIGNED IT AND 99% UNLESS SOMETHING WAS WRONG, THE COURT WILL GIVE THE LEASE AS GOOD.

THE STATE OF OHIO NEEDS TO REFINE THE LEASE OF OIL AND GAS AND MAKE THE LEASES TO A CERTAIN PAY ZONE ONLY PER LEASE. THE STATE NEEDS TO CHARGE FOR A LEASE OF SOMETHING LIKE 3000.00 TO 5000.00, THIS WOULD STOP THE GARBAGE OUT THERE AND TRYING TO STEAL PEOPLE LAND, THE STATE SHOULD BE TOLD BY THE PEOPLE THAT HAVE LAND TO CONTROL THE LEASE'S SO THE PEOPLE CAN BE PROTECTED. THE LAWYERS ARE MAKING A KILLING ON THIS OIL AND GAS IN OHIO AND PA. SO I THINK THE STATES SHOULD MAKE IT MANDATORY A STARTING PRICE AND A STATE FEE FOR LEASING PROPERTY AND THEY MUST BE PER AREA OR VEIN OF GAS NOT ALL OF THE RESORCES. THIS WOULD STOP PEOPLE FROM BEING SCREWED OUT OF MONEY FOR THERE PROPERTY. EVERY ZONE HAS GAS IN IT. AND THE COMPANY SHOULD ONLY GET THAT ONE SOURCE NOT THE COMPLETE ZONE TO THE CENTER OF EARTH. THIS WOULD STOP THE BALONY AND THE LAWYERS FROM MAKING MILLIONS OFF PEOPLE BECAUSE OF CROOK OIL PEOPLE. PLUS THE STATES NEED THE TAX MONEY ALSO. THE FEES WOULD PAY FOR THE STATES TO TAKE CARE OF THERE PEOPLE THAT LIVE IN THE STATE. ( VOTE ME IN AS GOVERNOR I WOULD MAKE ALL THESE RULES ) I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHAT THE PEOPLE THINK OF MY IDEA? I KNOW MOST HAVE SIGNED ALLREADY BUT THERE ARE PLENTY OUT THERE THAT COULD USE THE HELP. ONE MORE THINK I THINK THE LEASEES SHOULD ONLY HAVE 1 YEAR TO DRILL A WELL OR THEY MUST REPAY FOR THE SECOND YEAR, THESE BILLIONARE COMPANIES GOING OUT AND SUCKING UP ALL THE LAND THEN SELLING IT FOR BILLIONS OF DOLARS PROFIT. THIS SHOULD STOP, THE STATES AND HE PEOPLE ARE GETTING CRUSHED BY THE CARPET BAGGER OIL MEN. BELIEVE ME I HAVE BEEN DOING MY HOME WORK I WILL GET SOME KIND OF PROTECTION FOR THE PEOPLE AND MAKE THE STATES MONEY AT THE SAME TIME.

0ym9x5ag7ury2Permalink Reply by 0ym9x5ag7ury2 on December 19, 2014 at 1:32pm

Ray,

    I would contest the lease if my wife signed and I hadn't signed. Leases like deed require joint signatures by both parties. If your well isn't producing then the lease terminates, it can't be held by production if it is not producing in paying quantities.

I noticed that there is a lot of talk to discourage landowners from taking action on websites, so you make the call. I've seen the XXXXXs with no signature but with contract I've made in the past both parties were required to initial.

If you have a discrepancy in your contract, contest it with a lawyer, don't listen to the do nothing general public. If I remember correctly, the Notaries in Ohio & WV who signed leases when they weren't present paid a price for illegal activity, so someone has the story wrong.

Hopefully OPEC will crush the oil and gas boom for a few years.

Before the next round of theft starts we need to inform our government that actions need to be taken to protect us. PA was left out in the cold for too long, and I saw the 2014 letter the PA gov wrote, go to Propublica.org to see his letters.

You can run for Ohio Gov in 2016. Don't forget why you were elected, to protect the people, not fill up your bank accounts with easy money.

Permalink Reply by Bill Bergseid on December 19, 2014 at 5:40pm

Main legislative items needed in Ohio (found in most oil producing states):  a statute requiring royalty payments to start within so many months (usually around 4-6) for the first well on a lease and every so many days thereafter (usually 30-90) once  production starts.  Failure to timely make these payments subjects the payor to interest penalties (usually 12-18%) plus costs and attorneys fees if needed to collect.  Wyoming goes further and provides that costs of production, including treating, compressing, dehydrating, and transporting gas or oil to market cannot be deducted from royalty payments.

Permalink Reply by RAY RATELL on December 20, 2014 at 3:48am

Thanks Ron I am in the process of a good battle 4 yrs now. my dad had some wells and he sold them but he wanted to sell just the gas from his well, and the lawyer that drew up the lease did a crapy job. ( best to find A oil and gas lawyer, a really good one.)

but here is the problem with lawyers I have a some friends as lawyers and they tell me there jobs is to be in court, so once you go to a lawyer you better have deep pockets they will do everything they can to keep you in court.

That is why there needs to be laws so these oil and gas people can not scam a property owner. Rules and laws wil keep the crooks away.

my dad put 3 men in jail in texas for selling wells and never completing them and taking the money. they do the same thing in all states, called investing. problem is the oil men can take you over the coals because there are no laws to protect you.

So I am asking anyone that has property to write your congress man to put up laws to protect the peoples money and there lands from thieves.

I oil man should not have more than 6 months to drill a well and once the lease is signed the time starts, if there is not well started in 6 months they have to pay again for the land. this will stop oil men from scaming the people.

At the same time it would stop lawyers from being begal dogs looking for the land owners money. it makes me so mad that there are more lawyers in the usa than all the rest of the world.

just because of my law suit I will make changes to the laws I am already asking to be the inspector in ohio, so I can make some laws up for the law makers in ohio.

people do not know but the federal government has many oil well they get royalties from, that is why the government spends so much money. all those wells in the oceans pay royalties to the usa.

I am glad this place is here, I will keep in touch and I would love to hear from people that have oil and gas problems.

I can see the next problem is gas transportations lines. they need regulations and royalties should be on those lines that cross a persons property not just a one time payment, it would not be a lot but the land owner should get paid just like east ohio gas gets paid for each cubic foot of gas that flows through there lines, even those lines are puco east ohio still gets paid to maintain them and it is a lot of money. so the land owner should get a piece of that royalty on gas transportation,

the people of America are getting screwed by oil and gas co, daily time to fight back and let the little guy make some money also.

Permalink Reply by Bill Bergseid on December 20, 2014 at 6:34am

I don't like the idea of you or the state telling me, a mineral owner, what I can and can't have in my lease.  Does the state really need to look out for everything in our lives?  If your diet or exercise regimen doesn't measure up to what I, the governor or the state feels it should be, do you really want any of us overseeing those aspects of your life?   Is the fact that I sign an oil and gas lease that doesn't protect me as much as you would wish any different from you leading a lifestyle that I or the state doesn't think is best for you?  If not, our health police will be by your place for morning workout and to check on the food in your refrigerator.  At least you don't have to suffer any consequences from my poor choices in signing an oil and gas lease.  Unfortunately, the rest of us have to bear the costs of you not eating and exercising properly. 

Permalink Reply by RAY RATELL on December 21, 2014 at 8:01am

I do not want the state or government to tell me what to do. I was saying that the states should protect the land owner from mineral buyers. if you ever had a mneral buyer come to you, you will know what I am talking about. they want everything for 1.00 and keep it for ever for 1.00 and maybe do nothing for ever.

so if the state says no you can not purchase mineral rights from a land owner for less than lets say 1000.00 per acre and must drill in 6 months or repay until you do drill ever 6 months, this would stop the billionares from screwing the land owner. I hope you under stand now.

now tell me you would not go for that?

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