Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Finnbear on September 24, 2011 at 5:46pm

Not necessarily. It all depends on the lease wording. A good (landowner friendly) lease would define a bit in the ground to hold a lease. I've seen some crappy (for the landowner) leases that define "site preparation" as an intent to drill and therefore HBP. There are companies in PA who have moved a dozer in and started grading an access road (and nothing else) in an attempt to retain expiring leases. Unless you know the exact lease wording, this is all speculation.

Permalink Reply by Janice Lanphere Hancharick on September 25, 2011 at 12:42pm

A lease can be held with NO drilling done.  The determining factor is the lease wording.  If you want a well on your property that reaches down and produces from the "deep" stuff in your lifetime, WITHOUT the company's expenses being taken from the royalty % before you ever see a penny, then the lease document better spell that all out.  Willing for well pad to be placed on your land?  Then be sure the lease says directional drilling will be done and you will receive a royalty payment on each on well ... specify the shale layers by name and depth, and the time frame that this must be accomplished in.  Failure to meet that time frame releases them and you from the lease agreement, but does allow both of you to negotiate another deal.  That way both sides have control and opportunity.

Simply agreeing to drilling "X" # of wells allows a company to turn your land into a piece of  Swiss cheese with little to show for what you gave up, and an environmental mess. Get with a solid group that has experienced and tech savvy representation in the negotiation ring.  

 Say "No!" to a Frac Pond.  Request a closed-loop system for deep soil and frac fluid removal.  This is not the moon and the stars.  It's what other areas are getting. Good luck.

Permalink Reply by Barbara on September 25, 2011 at 1:39pm

so much always to learn and beware of.  many great points here to read and heed..........if we are lucky enough to read BEFORE the great signing......

Permalink Reply by Karen Bagdes-Canning on September 25, 2011 at 2:38pm

Say "NO" to all of it.  Too many people are regretting ever leasing.

Read the following: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/23/nyregion/hydrofracking-leases-sub...

Permalink Reply by Barbara on September 25, 2011 at 3:45pm

that's a good approach; HOWEVER....i was sure since everyone around me was leased that whatever was under my nine acres would be removed anyway...who can check a mile under one's property plus i hear gas can leach over to where the well is, anyway...so i figured i would be careful in lease and go ahead to at least get some money for the aggravation of all that would be going on plus some of the gas...........................................lawyer knew diddly, even tho' he was promoted as so knowledgeable.......and yes, i am sorry now that i leased with the agreement as it is..............would have been much better off with a better lease.  for sure.  i think one needs a large block of people or a large amount of own land to get any benefit from NOT leasing.............pollution from equipment, drilling, pipelines, trucks, etc etc etc spills.....will happen even if one does not sign if any of the process is to go on near own land....this is a mess, clear and simple, but is not going away. 

Permalink Reply by Finnbear on September 25, 2011 at 5:24pm

I read that article. The main regrets people seem to have are that they didn't get a good enough deal ($) compared to what is available today. They could have waited. The oil and gas under them has been there for nearly an eternity and will stay there a few more years. I wonder how many of them who now have regrets actually consulted qualified legal and/or other expert counsel before signing? I'd bet most in that position just signed the lease and cashed the check and now that they have learned a bit they are having buyer's remorse. These people appear to have signed potential 6-figure long-term business deals with companies they didn't know without knowing exactly what they were signing and now they are upset about it. What other kind of high dollar business deal would you enter into today without knowing all the ramifications and consulting some experts before doing it?  We live in the information age - there is no excuse for going into something like this blind anymore. These lessors who are now unhappy were willing participants in these deals - I have not heard of a single instance where any of them were forced to sign leases at gunpoint. I think most of the buyers remorse we are seeing today is from people who blindly rushed in to deals they knew nothing about. Brings to mind the saying "When fools rush in...". If we pay any attention to history, we know that over a hundred years ago most of our coal rights were practically given away by our forefathers. Many of them regretted making those deals. History tends to repeat itself and when we choose to ignore it we are doomed to repeat the mistakes that were made in the past.

Permalink Reply by Finnbear on September 25, 2011 at 4:54pm

Tell me more about "a closed-loop system for deep soil and frac fluid removal".

Permalink Reply by Mike Zimmerman on September 21, 2011 at 6:14pm

Steve, That all depends on the language of the lease. Some leases all they need to do is show they are 'preparing' to drill. More landowner friendly leases say a bit must be in the ground to hold lease. So it is hard to know what is going to happen.

Permalink Reply by Janice Lanphere Hancharick on September 22, 2011 at 11:25am

Folks across OH would be wise to slow down on the signing.  The rush is hitting you because your area is hot, and companies want to sign up as much acreage ASAP before everyone knows exactly how they operate ... and owners know exactly what they have.  Action like this happened east of you in PA (and is sometimes repeated on the unwary), but Groups have become the way to go if you can find experienced professionals to represent  you.  Think "strength in numbers" and individuals won't be picked off like fish in a barrel.  A top-notch company will represent land/rights owners on a contingency fee basis.  They don't get paid unless you get paid.  That's a BIG incentive to get owners the best deal possible!

While there must surely be some Groups put together, the top one I'm aware of right now is Penn-Ohio... obviously in both states.  Do some more homework, and when it comes to lease language watch out for words like "intent", "capable of" , and the ever popular "preparing".  They are often found in Industry-friendly Leases.  Not good.  Held by production should refer to a substance being removed from the ground in the shale formation designated in the lease.  Specific depth ranges should be listed.  As for water pits and places where the earth dredged up from holes1,000's of feet down  can be dumped ... you don't want them!  In PA closed-loop systems are being used very successfully.  Companies can and are doing this in other areas, why not where you are?  It saves a mess and is an environmentally safe way to get the stuff away from you.  This is the beginning of  "leasing/drilling 101".  GET A GROUP GOING!

Good luck!   jlhanch@nc.rr.com

Permalink Reply by Karen Bagdes-Canning on September 22, 2011 at 7:08am

Steve, I spent the day two days ago with people who are surrounded by about 7 wells and a couple frack ponds.  These people are sick, they cannot go outside without being affected from air pollution.  Their homes are worth nothing because the water is ruined.  I can go on and on and on....

Permalink Reply by Finnbear on September 25, 2011 at 5:39pm

What exactly is the source of the air pollution you mention?

Permalink Reply by Larry Livengood on September 22, 2011 at 9:02am

a suggestion would be to go on Youtube and type in "natural gas Bradford" and watch a few videos... 

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