Forced Pooling and why we should all be against it.

I think most of us are also against forced pooling, but I choose to speak for myself here. We need to get on this and also oppose it because it DOES AFFECT ALL OF US. This also does not just involve the Utica Shale in PA. Trying to find out how many Marcellus wells are also permitted as Conservation Wells and will provide that later, but here's the skinny. Read the actual law below and tell me if you agree. The law states that they just have to penetrate the Onandaga Layer. A driller buddy of mine, who asked not to be named, tells me that the companies are chomping at the bit at this. He tells me all they have to do is go down and "penetrate" the Onandaga and the plan is to then back the drill off, plug that depth and drill the Marcellus and other layer they so choose. That means those of us who are pro-drilling are also screwed. Those who haven't leased yet and are haggling (for lack of a better word) for better bonus are screwed. (yes. that also is true for us in the Marcellus). All the driller has to do is say; "We tried. It's not our fault they won't accept $100/acre, so please give us their land, your honor". And your land will be theirs. It also hurts those of us that are looking at renewing lease. Same scenario. All they have to do is prove they offered us soemthing and the land is theirs.

Any well as deep as 3800 feet, they can now get from you for almost nothing.

Q. What is the difference between a “conservation” well and a “deep” well?

A “conservation” well is defined as any well penetrating the top of the Onondaga Limestone (or equivalent formation when the Onondaga is absent) and is at least 3,800 feet deep. This term is defined by the Oil and Gas Conservation Law. The Pennsylvania Geological Survey considers a “deep” well to be any well that penetrates the Middle Devonian Tully Limestone.

Additional Resource(s):


http://files.dep.state.pa.us/OilGas/BOGM/BOGMPortalFiles/LawsRegsGu...
OFOG 07-01.0

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Permalink Reply by Andrea Richlin on March 18, 2014 at 6:18am

The 1961 conservation law states  an overall unit limit of 10 square miles, although it does say it will be determined based on well size to eliminate waste. As to whether it would cover the Marcellus horizon , it sure looks like it would in my area, since the lower Marcellus generally is at a depth here of approx. 8000 ft.  Based on this excerpt from the law :


(b) This act shall not apply to or effect-

(1) Any well or wells which do not penetrate the Onondaga horizon, or in those areas in which
the Onondaga horizon is nearer to the surface than thirty-eight hundred feet, any well or wells
which do not exceed a depth of thirty-eight hundred feet beneath the surface. For the
purposes of this act, the question whether a pool is covered by the act shall be determined by
the depth of the producing interval in the discovery well in such pool, and if such producing
interval is covered by this act, even though some of the wells in the pool, if considered alone,
would not be covered by the act.       (End of excerpt)

As far as I can see , there also was no mention in this law of a producer needing voluntary participation by the majority of the royalty owners included in the unit , or any other voluntary percentage at all . It just seems have the limitation of a conservation well setback of 330 ft from the surface well hole to the boundary of the leased property the well hole is on , or 330 ft from the edge of the unit if a unit is in place.   If you had to release your land , it wouldn't even matter if you formed a group with your neighbors , you would have no bargaining power at all , as long as the producer held the lease where the well pad was , and they were drilling a conservation well.   So , since this law has been on the books since 1961 , how can you fight it ?

2z248p19vqnh9Permalink Reply by 2z248p19vqnh9 on March 23, 2014 at 12:44pm

Wait a minute - WHY is anyone who has reservations concerning 'proper code of conduct' labeled an 'anti-fracker'? - They should have the right to label you right back as GAStivist's.

 How do YOU know that things will come in in the wash as being ultimately EVERYONE getting skrewed BY the G/O Co.'s??? They don't owe YOU anything, Perotto - you are 'there' now...but where will you be 10 years from now - coming from WHAT position? - you & I don't know.

BOTTOM LINE: The Pirates don't care about the LANDOWNER - OR you, ot the 'fractivists'.... THEY DON'T CARE - about ANY of us! They only care about their bottom line & how much much of whatever it is that they can get away with.

Had a science teacher that used to say, "kill 'em with kindness"...we're all familiar of the stupid story of the frog that got boiled to death because it was a SLOW, somewhat 'comfortable' decline to  its death. Are WE, today, FROGS in the pot?

SURE - they'll go at things ANY way necessary to get just WHAT they want. You won't help them (and if you do - thank you...more power to THEM - thanks & go away...) & if you do - they'll throw you the littlest bone possible to keep you around for more dirty work.

Let's take environmentalists & all of that jazz out of this for time being...let's say that an individual doesn't have any problems with G/O drilling - just doesn't want it done on HIS land, or anywhere near it. Drill, baby, drill - just do it somewhere else.... I don't need the aggravation, I don't need or want the money...I just don't want it - I like what I've got, just the way it is. - do you somehow 'label' him a 'fractivist' or an independently minded individual? Has nothing to do with the water or the trees...just doesn't want it - doesn't need it...so just go away. Go Away, period.

--------------------------------------

I know all you all know about Pro-Landowner Royalty-Deduction Bill Passes Out of Committee: See h... this discussion...BIG MESS that is only going to GET WORSE - Frackers, anti-frackers, GAStivists, +++ - it's gonna get worse! & it AIN'T gonna 'get better' unfortunately.

So WHAT do you do about THAT? CRAM it down people's throats? >yep, shep - those good ole' G/O boys are gonna' get just what THEY WANT - with or without you &/or I...can't you see that?

You ain't nothing to them. None of us are. We're all up OIL CREEK without a paddle & we can't even count on 'our government - PA -or- USA' to do anything about it. We can yip & yapp like little puppy dogs...and they'll even throw a bone once in awhile...but this land AIN'T 'YOUR LAND' - it's no longer 'MY LAND'...this land is their to keep...it's only a bit more time until our goose is OBVIOUSLY COOKED. Once the horse is outta' the barn - hard time gettin' it back in.

This whole thing is NOT good - for ANYONE. GAStivist, fractivist...LANDOWNER...not good at all.

As one light lights another, nor grows less - so nobleness enkindles nobleness. IF they can 'take what they want WHEN & HOW they want' - what are YOU going to do? They're the big boys...we are just 'ants'.

Permalink Reply by paleface on March 17, 2014 at 7:00am

 My understanding of the Conservation law is if a well is drilled into the Onondaga layer there has to be 300 feet from the down hole of the deep well to the outside perimeter of the drilling unit.If the distance is less than that the gas company has to include the people on the perimeter in the unit how much of there land would be affected would be up to the DEP.unlike a Marcellus well in the N.E. that can be drilled right up against the perimeter of the drilling unit.

Permalink Reply by JE Keller on March 20, 2014 at 11:14am
Holdouts who are force pooled loose out on bonus money BUT they receive the highest royalty in the unit without paying high legal fees in negotiation.
I can only hope for this to come.
2z248p19vqnh9Permalink Reply by 2z248p19vqnh9 on March 23, 2014 at 12:50pm

JE Keller...***minus DEDUCTIONS*** ha, ha, HA! *Joke's on YOU & ME! Tee-Hee!!!

As one light lights another, nor grows less - so nobleness enkindles nobleness. Go on - have some more fun talkin' bout this, that, and the other thing...go on...all the while - the water's gettin' hotter...

As one light lights another, nor grows less - so nobleness enkindles nobleness.

Permalink Reply by bo boboski on March 23, 2014 at 1:15pm

Really? -------------------------  Really?

Permalink Reply by paleface on March 23, 2014 at 2:04pm

GG, I hope there gas lights your lighting there. 

Permalink Reply by LERRET on March 21, 2014 at 3:31pm

Arkansas has fixed square mile units. This is arbitrary. Each unit prorates production. Therefore, no one can be spaced out. Anyone not joining can be integrated but they also get a lease which is sans post-production expenses. It is the fairest system I know overall.  So no, I am not against pooling per se. What I see in PA and OH however, is not a good system

Permalink Reply by Clinton44 on March 21, 2014 at 5:31pm

Please read the story in the link I have pasted below this story was on this site a while back. It makes a very good case for forced pooling.

http://files.dep.state.pa.us/PublicParticipation/MarcellusShaleAdvi...

I can tell you the final outcome of this particular saga as we are in this unit. The Smith's ( who I understand are/were very opposed to drilling) got there wish and were not included in the unit. It took a while but the unit was simply reconfigured and the sixth well was drilled, leaving the Smith's as well as some VERY UNHAPPY neighbors out of the unit and therefore out of the $$$. So now tell me what did the Smith's gain by holding out?? What did they gain for their neighbors that were left out??

Permalink Reply by Billy Park Whyde on March 21, 2014 at 7:42pm

To me it all boils down to what (was) a fundamental Constitutional Right in regards to Personal Property Rights. I might not like you clear cutting your land adjacent to mine but it's your land. Meanwhile however I do not want what you want to do with your land over ruling the rights that I have upon the land I paid for.

Permalink Reply by Frank Nesmith on March 24, 2014 at 4:23am

This is a sticky subject and I am glad to see all sides in this express how they feel. I think the main issue here is, Can this O &G company take away these landowners rights for private gain?

2z248p19vqnh9Permalink Reply by 2z248p19vqnh9 on March 24, 2014 at 8:50am

Frank Nesmith - WHAT is stoppin' them? REALLY? What are we/you gonna' do - go fight them in court? The Court can't even STAND UP for the INDIVIDUAL LANDOWNER's - Retroactive pmt. (for 'DEDUCTIONS' to Royalty checks TO 'Landowners'??? - to 'right the wrong' is shill now...Pshaw!!!

...'sticky subject' - YES inDEEDy (DEED!)...and we're not talking 'hot cross buns' here...

..."I am glad to see all sides in this express how they feel." - what MORE can you do? - you're NOT going to 'get anywhere' REALLY(?)!

..."Can this O &G company take away these landowners rights for private gain?" - what are you OBSERVING - HEARING/READING on THIS very site?!...what are you gonna' do? Hmmm? - THAT is where THEY have US! - oh, SURE...we CAN 'do something' & they'll just drag us out & further out...and ON it goes - and YOU don't get nothin'!

***Up OIL CREEK without a PADDLE. --- like that one GAStivists? Fractivists?...

It's the 'Rockafeller way'...it's just that NOW the 'complany' is divided into a number of 'subsidiaries' - under the same umbrella...that they are able to STILL profit handsomely from (what? - $12 - $14 BILLION $$$ +++ profit! PER G/O Co. - the 'big boys...) AND 'write off' those matters +++CHARGE the LANDOWNER 'deductions' ---DEDUCTIONS!!! - and just HOW manny YEARS will it take to get THAT straight (and THAT is just the BEGINNING, m'boy!).

Nobody's know the troubles I've seen...(oh YES - YOU have...it's just that YOU need to 'open your eyes'...it's a nasty, brutish world.). asonelightlightsanothernorgrowslesssonoblenessenkindlesnobleness

Frank - YES they can, YES they are, YES they will continue to do so...on & on & on...wish I could say otherwise.... THINK, cover your behind & watch your back & READ! KNOWLEDGE is power.

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