Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by paleface on August 28, 2011 at 2:10am

When you signed did you have a notary witness and put his seal on the contract? 

Permalink Reply by Lynn Wigglesworth on August 28, 2011 at 2:33am

The landman WAS the notary. That's what I mean about 'conflict of interest'

Permalink Reply by paleface on August 28, 2011 at 2:43am

If he put a current PA. seal on the contract than I don't see a problem,

Permalink Reply by Doug Pierson on August 28, 2011 at 2:59am

Hi Lynn.  Yes, his job was to get you to sign the lease, and yes, he will financially benefit from getting the lease signed - but he benefits the same even if he doesn't act as notary.  Acting as notary doesn't change anything.  As a notary, his duty in this case was to authenticate your identity and to witness your signature, in order to confirm that the real Lynn WIgglesworth was the one who signed the lease.  He's not representing you or giving you legal advice regarding the lease; he's only a witness.  Unless he actually charged you for his notary services, its all good.

Permalink Reply by Lynn Wigglesworth on August 28, 2011 at 6:58am

East did that a lot a few years ago; have the landowner sign, then get the signature notarized later...that's completely illegal...the notary is swearing that they verified who the person was and watched them sign the document.

Permalink Reply by Ann Ticopa on August 28, 2011 at 5:25am

Neither the landman nor his employer are a party to the agreement.  And this  wasn't an instance where a landowner signed "on the spot", without any negotiation.  This is a step up from what East used to do, have the landowners sign and then take a batch of leases to a cooperative notary.

 

I think leases should have a short "cooling off" period.  The gascos might lose a few leases, but it would be a good PR move. 

Permalink Reply by Lynn Wigglesworth on August 28, 2011 at 7:04am

I wondered because the landman either gets a commission or salary to lease people, so he profits from getting people to sign. It just seemed to me that someone who benefits from me signing shouldn't also be notarizing it.

Permalink Reply by Ann Ticopa on August 28, 2011 at 10:49am

I'm not comfortable with the practice either.  But if I was trading in a vehicle on a new one, wouldn't it likely be the dealer's employee who would notarize my signature on the trade-in's title?

Permalink Reply by Doug Pierson on August 28, 2011 at 1:27pm

Exactly, Ann.  What Josie described was clearly playing fast and lose with the rules.  To witness a signature, a person has to be in the room to witness the signing in real time.  But a notary witnesses a signature, not a document.  Notarization does not make a document legal, it only proves that a signature is genuine.  I did find a reference, though, that a document could be already signed when presented to the notary, provided the notary had satisfactory evidence of identity.  But, I don't think that would be common anymore.  A second type of notary function is to administer an oath that the signer takes attesting that a statement is true.  But, once again, it is the signature being notarized and not the document.  The notary is not attesting to the truth or legality of the document, only that the signer took an oath that it was.  Bottom line, in the cases of the gas lease or buying a car, they are simply witnessing a signature, not declaring a contract legal or valid.

 

Congrats to Lynn for signing a lease and hopes that she doesn't have to split too much with the ex.

Permalink Reply by Lynn Wigglesworth on August 28, 2011 at 1:45pm

I got the property in the divorce settlement (we refinanced together so he could take his half of the farm value in cash), but, because I haven't been able to refinance in my name alone, his name is still on the deed (and mortgage). But he's agreeable and the landman drew up a document for my ex to convey all bonus and royalty payments to me (which he signed). The bank draft is in my name alone, as any royalties will be. Yay!

Permalink Reply by paleface on August 28, 2011 at 11:47pm

Lynn i'm just curious how does a bank draft work do you wait 90 days and then the money is there or is it a standard check you can cash at your liberty.I read the description on wiki- but couldn't understand it.?

Permalink Reply by Lynn Wigglesworth on August 29, 2011 at 12:44am

I'm supposed to deposit it to my bank and Shell has 90 days to decide if they are going to honor it or not, so it's not in any way binding...they could void the lease at any time in the next 90 days.  By the way, the landman/notary also signed my bank draft...I thought it would at least be from Shell, but it doesn't mention Shell anywhere on the draft.

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